How to Finance Rental Properties in a High-Rate Market | Ted Sandalakis

Ted Sandalakis (00:00)
I’m an investor, which means, you know what, you can’t look at it every day. It’s like looking at your 40K or 401k every day and everything and wondering, you know, why is it not going up? You have to look at it from the law the the big picture. Look at it from three, five years, ten years down the road and everything. Once you start looking at that.

That’s how all the big boys, that’s how they got to be that big, because they looked at the big picture and everything. They did they do things for long term.

Scott Bursey (01:58)
Welcome back to the Real Estate Pros podcast, powered by Investor Fuel I’m your host, Scott Bursey And today, pros, we’re delighted to be joined by Ted Sandalakis from Arbor Financial Group. With over two decades in the mortgage industry and a laser focus on serving real estate investors, Ted brings a wealth of experience to the table.

Ted Sandalakis (01:58)
Let me know what

Scott Bursey (02:18)
Pros expect to learn how to navigate today’s lending landscape and leverage professional relationships to scale your portfolio. Ted, welcome to the show.

Ted Sandalakis (02:29)
Thanks, Scott. Thanks for having me. I’m really looking forward to this conversation that me and you’re ready to have and you know, getting the word out there, you know, spreading the good gospel, so to speak.

Scott Bursey (02:39)
Absolutely, Ted. It’s a pleasure to have you here, my friend, and to help our listeners get up to speed. Please give us the 90 second highlight reel of how your career ignited and where you’re pouring your fuel now.

Ted Sandalakis (02:51)
Gotcha. So I got in the business back around ninety seven and everything because

⁓ you know, I was looking for work. I just came sort of out of college. I just moved down south and everything, and I saw the advertisements for loan officer, and I was like, wow, let me go have some conversations with some of these folks and everything. And they took, you know, they gave me the parameters of the job and everything, but it checked all the boxes because you know I wanted to get into something that I believed in, something that was wholesome and something that I could really stand behind and everything. ⁓ because you know, it’s really brought about, you know, the true

entrepreneurship.

⁓ so really one of the big things there that I liked about it, when I say that it, you know, I can stand behind it is that, you know, in life we need th you know, Scott, we need three things to survive. We need food, water, and shelter. So I’m like, okay, I’m helping them provide shelter and everything like this. I can stand behind that. I love the marketing aspect of it. You know, I loved it more like, okay, I’m more like an independent contractor. I’m self-employed. It’s like my business without being my business. I don’t have all the

headaches of having the you know the overhead, all the little compliance stuff. But most of all I got to go out there, talk to people, help them out.

Scott Bursey (04:06)
A

Ted Sandalakis (04:06)
Also work with other real estate agents and a lot of good re referral sources and everything. so when I started working with people and you know when you’re starting to help people consolidate their you know their debt, that’s all I was really doing when I first got in the business, you know, helping them sort of you know consolidate their debt, save money, giving them funds. You know, it just got to be real contagious for me. And it wasn’t, you know, like yeah, I was making some good money and everything, but again, at the same time I was really

Helping people out and everything. And the more I did it and everything, it was like, wow, this is where I can see myself going for the future and everything. You know, I was a young man when I first started, I didn’t know what I wanted to do. That was the whole thing. I went through the whole 20s. What am I gonna do in life? What is gonna make Ted happy and everything? So when I got into that and everything.

It really did going back and checked all the boxes. You know, it was challenging. It brought down the marketing. I can sort of do as I see fit and everything. And I’m I’m helping people going back to, you know, ⁓ I had a stand behind it. Again, I mentioned that we need food, water, and shelter to survive. And I’m helping somebody out with shelter right there. We all need a place to live. You know, you’re either gonna rent

Or you’re gonna buy, or if you’re gonna buy, you need to be able to sort of ⁓ it’s gonna be your largest asset. And if I can help you manage that and sort of consult you on that, then that’s something pretty wholesome that I can stand behind and everything. There are certain things that I was getting offered to be, you know, come in and sell and everything. I just didn’t really believe it in my heart and everything, Scott. Long story short, you know? ⁓ but that answered your question and everything, you know?

So yeah, I started off in nineteen ninety-seven and yeah, going back to you’ve been in here two decades, it’s closer to three. It’s coming up to be three and everything. So yeah, I’ve seen a lot of stuff happen, you know, in the business, and a lot of it’s good.

Scott Bursey (06:03)
Thanks for sharing that, Ted. That’s an incredible journey. And what really caught my attention about you was the way you’ve been able to master the niche of working with investors for over 20 years, turning complex mortgage hurdles into simple pathways for growth. And on that note, curious to know, Ted, how did you maintain such consistency in your strategy during the major shifts in the mortgage market over the last two decades?

Ted Sandalakis (07:17)
You know, like anything else or any type of business, you’re gonna have a lot of changes going on, you know, ⁓ regardless. I don’t care which industry you’re in, what field you’re in, you’re gonna have some ups, downs, some challenges, some bumps and some bruises. So it’s just really riding out the storm. And if you’re consistently being in it and everything, ⁓ it’s gonna show that you’re a true professional in everything. You know, you just can’t be in the business when the times are good or when the and then leaving the time is bad. You ca you know.

If ever seen a doctor or a CPA or anybody else get out because things got to be a little tough or it wasn’t, you know, you never seen that. So a true professional should be someone that says, you know what? ⁓ regardless of the good or time or the challenging times or the changing of the loan programs, you know what? I’m gonna stick around here because there’s still people that still need to be guided and need to be consulted and what need to reinvest. And that’s where I sort of say, you know, you gotta.

You gotta ride out the storm so to speak, but there’s always a little bit of light at the end of the tunnel. And it’s always you know, just hanging in there. And it depends how you look at things and everything at the light of the end of the tunnel, you know? You gotta have that positive vision.

Scott Bursey (08:28)
Ted, given your extensive history, what do you see as your biggest internal strength that keeps investors coming back to Arbor Financial?

Ted Sandalakis (08:37)
⁓ that’s a great question, Scott. I really do appreciate that. One of them that I can’t say is just my experience is just being able to, you know, have a rapport with people, being available, and you know, ⁓ just having a conversation with them, treating them like a person, you know.

⁓ maybe a lot of other loan officers and lenders or banks, you know, if they look at your numbers and you’re not you doing X amount of business, they might not want to talk to you and everything. Me, I’ll talk to just anybody from A to Z on this that has a desire that wants to become an investor, wants to work and everything. ⁓ because they all gotta start off from somewhere.

And then they’re like the best folks to work with because then they’re gonna be more of a customer for life and they’re gonna refer you out to friends and family and everything. So it’s not always about you know you wanna have that perfect type of clientele and everything. You wanna make them perfect as far as I’m concerned and everything. But to go on back to having two ears, one mouth, what God gave you and everything, listen to what they wanna do, help them out and consult them and everything. And they’ll know that you’re a straight shooter.

Once you have a conversation with them versus, you know, somebody that just wants to force something down with or put in a position that’s not gonna make success or successful, I should say. Yeah, that’s my approach, Scott.

Scott Bursey (09:57)
Building on that, Ted, how do you actively nurture the human element, you know, to heighten that within the team culture there at Arbor Financial Group?

Ted Sandalakis (10:09)
So, you know, how I sort of work with this really, you know, helping out with culture and everything and what Arbor has to bring and everything, you know, Arbor helps me out with my support, with my back what we call the back end of the office. You know, they put together, you know, some really good lenders for me to sort of work with.

That I can bring on. So I’m out there, whatever I say I can do, you know, I’ll be able to deliver. You know, they just don’t have to lit trust my lip service. That you know, they can know that I can close and I’m not taking their heads off with fees and this and everything else that goes along with it. So Arbor definitely was a good place for me to partner up with. You know, they have they’re very polished, they got a really good reputation. I checked them out.

And most of all, when you look at the loan officers that are there, they’re there for quite a long time and everything. And a lot of them are doing some big numbers. So I’m like, okay, those are a couple of things, big things that a loan officer is usually look at. They don’t have high turnover. And that’s something that, you know, it happens in our industry. You’ll see a lot of people, again, come and go, or they’ll, you know, would do what they call the change lenders and everything. mine is, I’ll be truthful, my other big thing is my follow-up.

You gotta be in front of people and everything. And you gotta be available. If my phone rings, I pick it up. You know, there’s a lot of people that I know, loan officers and real estate agents. If they don’t see they don’t if their phone rings and they don’t see the number or they don’t recognize it, they don’t bother.

And again, you know what? I get people that call me up from all over the country because they’ve heard about me and everything. And that’s one of the things I like working with investors. It just doesn’t have to be here in the Carolinas, you know. So I I like to make myself available. I’m not saying I’m a human ATM machine, but you gotta sort of be sort of like one and everything. You know? So hopefully that answered your question, Scott.

Scott Bursey (12:01)
Thank you for elaborating on that, Ted. And looking back, what’s one area of the mortgage business where you feel you’ve had to work the hardest to overcome a perceived weakness, perhaps?

Ted Sandalakis (12:47)
Well, you know, going back to good and bad times and everything, I think the toughest time was during the housing crisis. You know, I do gotta admit, you know, there’s a lot of things. I don’t wanna dwell on that. That’s a whole other conversation, by the way, Scott. We can have a whole conversation, I’ll talk to you about that. But it the big problem after the housing crisis was sort of ⁓ you know, a lot of pr lot of homes were, you know, they’re deflated in value and everything. So people wanted to buy

But the only problem when they go to purchase them and everything, a lot of them were foreclosures and people that were leaving them were sort of not that kind. They’re ripping out anything of value and everything, you know. So to offer a financing on homes that don’t have plumbing, that don’t have like the the AC that’s still in there, that’s you know, have some that needs some major renovations, that got to be real difficult. Even and that’s why a lot of people say, you know what, I’ll wait for prices to drop.

And I’ll buy then Ted. And I say, Time out here. And I tell them my little story about, you know, yeah, it was a great time to buy a home and everything because the prices were right.

But the financing was very difficult. So and what that does is that affects actually the values of a lot of homes too when all these foreclosures were going. I say the best time to buy is right now or even yesterday. You know, prices are going up, you can get financing. If the prices start falling, and we have a lot of foreclosures, you’re gonna have a much more difficult time to have be able to get financing for any of your homes that you’re thinking about purchasing. So

And that’s my sort of c my aunt you know when I look at it. So getting value was probably during that was probably the most difficult thing. And you know, getting people to sort of mentally say, yeah, it’s still a good time to invest. And we know the ones that did invest, they made out like bandits, you know. They really did. They had that foresight and everything, you know? So that’s probably when I think the toughest time. And all the lenders tightened up.

Scott Bursey (14:39)
Yeah.

Ted Sandalakis (14:43)
you know, during the housing after during the housing crisis and even afterwards. You know, they were making up their own guidelines. They were scared to lend money out because they knew if they lend money out and the home is worth X amount of money and everything, then maybe in another twelve to eighteen months that house could probably be dropping in value and everything. So they had to wait ’til things get stabilized. That was a very challenging time, you know.

but that’s a whole nother conversation. We could have a whole nother, you know, podcast on that, Scott.

Scott Bursey (15:12)
And Ted, thinking about the current market, where do you see the biggest untapped opportunity right now for investors looking to secure financing?

Ted Sandalakis (15:21)
So right now I think it’s, you know, the best place probably is just to you know, the park your money and everything is going back for investors. A couple good places I look at and people don’t and you know, these are my little secrets that I sort of tell people.

Look at some other places that you know not everybody’s always going to. When everybody zigs, I like to zag. One of the places I think people need to look at is you know college areas. Student housing is very big. You know, that’s probably one of the best places to park your money and everything. the other thing, too, is you know, find out where there’s some big businesses moving and everything. You know, they’re big area right now.

I wanna say short term rentals, you know, maybe near hospitals, because a lot of times the nurses and you know, they might need places to rent out so they maybe find their own place is a great place. And you know what? Since we’re taught in the summertime and everybody goes on vacation and they go, wow, you know, they can end up you know, maybe renting out a condo or a placing it on the water.

you know, for a week or for, you know, for that time period and everything. And they think, wow, you know what? It’d be a nice thing for us to buy to maybe reinvest in everything. And I say, you’re right. You know, think about it that way. Next time you’re on vacation, look at it because there’s a reason why it’s such in demand and everything. You know, you want places in the mountains, places in the beach and everything. You know, take a look at that. Let’s see what we can do for you. But those are good places to sort of to invest your funds at.

They’re very much in demand and everything. so you know, I I look at it, I look at some of those areas. But going back to student housing, you know, we’re always gonna have colleges. Kids are always gonna need places to rent at. You know, go into places like that and click, you know, pick up some rentals, put up some how you know, student, you know, put up some units that you know that can return around and rent at. And you know what? You you’re gonna it’s it’s a pretty much a safe bet in that capacity.

Scott Bursey (17:57)
Ted,

in today’s climate, what do you view as the biggest threat that you’re facing as it relates to Arbor Financial Group, Ted?

Ted Sandalakis (18:04)
I got you on that. So right now probably one of the biggest challenges and I’ll be truthful Scott, you know the rates. Yeah, they are a little bit on the high end.

You know, when you’re sort of looking at somebody’s what their monthly payment is gonna be on the home and everything, and to be able to say tell them, you know what? ⁓ yeah, you might not make a lot of money monthly based on what you’re putting down and everything, but look at the appreciation on this. You know, right here, you know, we’re in the I’m in the Carolinas right outside Charlotte. You know, a lot of the homes and everything, you know, are appreciating, you know, five, seven, you know, we’re all we were up in the double digits for a while.

So that’s where I sort of, you know, going back, they have to have a leap of faith. They have to have that little bit of confidence. Say, you know what? Yeah, I’m an investor, which means, you know what, you can’t look at it every day. It’s like looking at your 40K or 401k every day and everything and wondering, you know, why is it not going up? You have to look at it from the law the the big picture. Look at it from three, five years, ten years down the road and everything. Once you start looking at that.

That’s how all the big boys, that’s how they got to be that big, because they looked at the big picture and everything. They did they do things for long term. And that’s when you when you’re an investor, you gotta start strategizing yourself. You know what? I just don’t want to sort of look at the next six months or next year. I want to look at the next three to five years. Yeah, that’s gonna be a vital piece of property because I know there’s a lot of business around here. It might not be that we value that much today and everything, but

But three to five, seven years from now, that’s gonna be a gold mine. You have to have that vision and you have to see what are the some of the neighboring businesses that’s gonna put drive that area up and everything, if that makes sense.

Scott Bursey (19:47)
And that is winning.

Ted Sandalakis (19:50)
That is winning. That’s money. Yeah. Looking at the big picture, the long term, you know, three, five, seven, ten years, even longer, you know, that’s where you want to park your money.

And you that’s where generational wealth comes up and everything. That’s where you can sort of leave them to your kids and say, you know what? You guys can be glad I bought that property ten years ago and everything. Because by the time your kids get it and everything, this is you

They’re your name is gonna be known on that. You’re gonna be getting phone calls to sell and everything. And hopefully they don’t. They hold on to it and everything.

Scott Bursey (20:23)
Ted, beyond the standard market data, what emerging trend are you watching that you believe will disrupt investors lending in let’s say the next twelve months?

Ted Sandalakis (20:32)
I I to disrupt it, is that what you’re asking about? To make you

Scott Bursey (20:36)
Yes, to that would create some interference, some hurdles in regards to ⁓ investor lending. Let’s say the next a year or so, Ted.

Ted Sandalakis (20:44)
Okay, we’re gonna go down the rabbit hole, Scott. We’re gonna go down the rabbit hole. I’m gonna say the media. The media is gonna always hinder you. They’re gonna act like they’re a bunch of they’re you know, they know what they’re talking about. And again, the media is always their news and they wanna, you know, they wanna draw traffic or they wanna get people to listen to them and everything. So they’re gonna tell you something to make it their viewpoint, and they have no

They have no knowledge of it and everything. Like I can’t get up and talk about

medical or anything like this. I’m not a consultant in that thing. And they flick to cut when they get up there and they start talking, they get like secondhand news. They’re not really ones to be, you know, they’re not in the business to really understand it. And a lot of people tend to listen to them. You know, they’re the probably the biggest culprit. If we can get more of the media to be on our side and everything and say, yeah, the rates are this and this and everything today. But you know how much money you’ll be making on appreciation? If they got away from that dirty word, sometimes interest rates

Right. And bring in that nice fresh word appreciation and you know, yeah, that’s something that they need to really do. So I think the big culprit of anything that sort of hinders us in real estate is the media. You know, if they can be more user-friendly and be sort of like understand what they’re talking about, or you know, if they had the more wisdom.

I would say listen to and everything, but nine times out of ten a lot of these folks are just sort of you know, they’re not knowledgeable about it. And again, they wanna be able to get more people to listen to ⁓ So they’re gonna get up there, they’re gonna be a little bit more what I call the little rabble rousers. They’re gonna they want everyone to listen. So they’re gonna be saying some w stuff that I wouldn’t say out there to to a lot of people, you know.

Scott Bursey (22:28)
Ted, if you could walk us through what does your professional network look like right now?

Ted Sandalakis (22:32)
that’s a good question. I really do appreciate that one because you know, it’s not what you probably think it is. I like to have different folks and everything. I like to have a little bit of everybody in my sort of circle. When I say my referral sources and everything, you know, ⁓ so I, you know, I w actually as a loan officer everyone thinks, you know, wow Ted, you must know a lot of l ⁓ real estate agents. And I do, you know.

They’re probably on the top tier of my food chain, but you know what? They’re not everybody. I love to know people who know people and everything. That’s my biggest thing. I want to be in the middle and I want to be surrounded by 20 or 30 people. And each one of those people, I want them to know a lot of people. So insurance agents know a lot of people. ⁓ CPAs, tax people are a great source for me to know. ⁓ financial planners.

But I going back to investors, I like to, you know, work with a lot of people that are hands on, the electricians, the plumbers, because they all sort of work cahoots together and everything. So once they get one of that’s you know, ⁓ wanna become an investor, then a couple of them all wanna be that and everything.

And once they start working together, they’ll offer their services as at a reduced cost and everything. And they all like to help each other. So I want to say, you know what? I want to have a mixed group there. I just don’t want to have just real estate agents. Yeah, I want to have investors, but investors can come from a lot of different folks and everything. ⁓ and I wanted them to be able to bring value when I’m talking to financial planners. You know, I just don’t want a financial planner or a CPA or somebody just to say, you know.

I can do your taxes. This is they should be able to consult you and say, Wow, man, you know what? You got all these properties, you got all this money, then you have all this debt, or if you need to do this, you know what? There’s other loan products that you might be able to capitalize that can sort of give you a better bank for your dollar. You need to be able to bring value. Otherwise, if you were sort of one of those persons that’s sort of, you know, a customer of that fine.

that CPA or that tax person and they didn’t consult you or sort of gave you some other ideas, I think you’re more round you know, there’s a good chance you’re gonna be going to someone that’s gonna be able to offer those programs and say, Listen, I got some other ideas for me. Just hear me out and, you know, just to at least let you know about it and everything, Scott. So

Scott Bursey (24:54)
Yeah. Incredible. It really shows how much value you’ve poured into your relationships, Ted. And you’ve given us a lot of value here today, but is there any additional words of wisdom that you can leave here with our pros?

Ted Sandalakis (25:07)
Yeah. ⁓ when it’s coming to investing in real estate, you always gotta think people need a place to live. Go on back when you you know, y y in order to survive need food, water and shelter. You know, people are always gonna need shelter, you know, people are always gonna need the rent still.

You know, so as from coming from an investor and everything, yeah, there’s a lot of people that says say, you know what? With my lifestyle, I don’t want to buy. You know, yeah, I wish everybody would want to buy, but a lot of people would still rather rent and everything, which is fine. You know, so people that want to become investors always understand that. That you know what? ⁓ there’s always g other good approaches to e you know, just not buying just to put people in there. You know, we haven’t even got into fixing flips and s you know that. People that can say, you know what?

I don’t want to play landlord. You know what? I see these other homes. I can g sort of pick them up. You know what? I can do a lot of the work myself. As long as I can make X amount of money afterwards and be able to turn around and sell it quick, I’m fine with that and everything. So it’s more like just going back to, you know, letting people know that, you know, you there’s different approaches. You know, not everybody can live with their in-laws is the way I look at it, Scott, you know. And if you can, God bless you and everything, you know.

But a lot of people still need the rent, and that’s probably a good thing for investors. And a lot of people are always gonna want to go on vacation. So they’re gonna need a place to probably rent for the week or for the month and everything. So, you know, look at it from that perspective. ⁓ and also going back to don’t forget, and you know, I think I gave a little bit of my little about student housing. You know, college kids are always gonna get me able to, you know, they don’t want to live in dorms. You know, they might say, you know what, that’s not for me. I’ve been in there for a year or two.

I’m not productive with my studies and I don’t need to be bothered. You know, that’s another whole other way to you know that we can talk about is as far as being an investor, looking at student housing, renting them out, or even if you’re got kids that are gonna be going to college, look at buying in them a place. You figure you can park your money there for the next four years, they can rent out a room or two to help out with the cost. At the end of the four years, turn around and sell it. And again,

What comes after four years? You’re gonna have a nice little appreciation. The whole idea is to let your money work for itself and everything. You know, that’s the whole idea. And again, when you’re talking to p people that are sorta made it, what you want to call in life and everything, they just don’t have the vision, but they w they let their money work for themselves. And they start instead of working hard, they’re working smart. You have to do both. You just can’t say, you know what, I want to be the hardest working guy. No.

You wanna be the smartest per you know, you wanna be able to know how to do both. Work smart and work hard and everything.

Scott Bursey (27:51)
Ted, thank you for that. And for those of our listeners that want to keep this conversation moving, stay in your lane or collaborate with you, what is the best way for them to reach you?

Ted Sandalakis (28:00)
So I’m always gonna say you can always call me at 704-575-4886 or my website, which is very easy. It’s just Ted Sands T-E-D Sands-S-A-N-D-S .com. You’ll be able to pull up my site. It’s got all my contact information. I’m all over LinkedIn. I’m all over Facebook and everything. So

⁓ I wish I was Batman just to put the big shiny light in the sky and everything. So I’m trying to make myself accessible. So I went with the website Ted Sands because I was like, everybody can remember that. Okay, great. There you go. And yeah, let me know. I’ve always loved the schedule time to talk to people and everything and just find out what they’re trying to do. And again, I’m just, you know, I just don’t work in here in the Carolinas. Going back to Arbor, yeah, we’re in forty-eight states. So even if I can’t do alone in

I’m not licensed in that state. I can always refer it or I can still pretty much do it and I know I can get it done and still be the eyes and ears on the loan and everything.

Scott Bursey (29:03)
Yeah. Ted, thank you so much for joining us today on the Real Estate Pros podcast. This has been a pleasure.

Ted Sandalakis (29:09)
No, Scott, the pleasure’s mine, really. Whenever you get a chance, I love to talk about real estate, about mortgages, and about the whole real estate. Because I think there’s a lot of misconceptions out there. And I just wanted someone to hear it from someone that’s been in the business a while and somebody that’s a loan officer. And ⁓ i you know, we just gotta be spreading the word out there and everything. And you know, it’s

Scott Bursey (29:27)
Yeah.

Ted Sandalakis (29:33)
again the media always wants to portray a doom and gloom and everything and it’s not always out there, you know. I’ll I’ll be truthful on that. You know, hear from somebody else, but ⁓ get somebody else’s perspective. You know, go out there and, you know, take the leap of faith and everything if you want to get into it, one at facet or another and everything. But Scott, thank you. Seriously. Appreciate it.

Scott Bursey (29:56)
Thank you, Ted. And to our listeners, we appreciate you. If you receive value from today’s episode, please subscribe. We’ll be filling your tanks with a lineup of elite guests just like Ted, who are accelerating and setting the pace for the rest of the industry. Until next time, keep your standards high and your vision clear. We’ll see you in the next episode, everyone.