How Steve Fingerman Scaled His Real Estate One-Stop Shop

Steve Fingerman (00:00)
The biggest thing I would say is,

Be very careful on the acquisition, right? There’s an old saying that your money is made on the buy, not on the sell. And if you buy it wrong, you’re going to have a really tough time all the way through. So we want to really carefully analyze what the acquisition looks like, how much spread there really is, what the property is going to

Michelle Kesil (01:53)
Hey everyone, welcome to the Investor Fuel Podcast. I’m your host, Michelle Kesil And today I’m joined by someone I’ve been looking forward to chatting with, Steve Fingerman, who’s been making serious moves in the mortgage, real estate, title shop, so many industries and spaces combined into one. So

Really excited to have you here with us, Steve. I think our listeners are really going to take something away from how you’re approaching creating such a unique one-stop shop business, bridging all of these modalities together. So let’s dive in.

Steve Fingerman (02:40)
Sounds great, Michelle. Thank you, and I’m happy to be here.

Michelle Kesil (02:43)
Amazing. So first off, for people who may not be familiar with you and your world yet, can you give us the short version of what is your main focus these days?

Steve Fingerman (02:58)
Main focus right now is scaling and building the real estate business, but we do a little bit of everything, right? We’re a one-stop shop, so we have the mortgage company, which is E-Loan’s mortgage, People’s Trust Realty for the real estate side, and then Trusted Title on the title side to sort of bring it all together and facilitate our closings as much as we possibly can. ⁓ Right now, the real estate business is growing for us.

So we’ve gone from the beginning, I think we opened up with like eight agents. And in a very short period of time, we scaled it up to 108 right now. I think I have four more just in the middle of onboarding that haven’t officially come on yet. But it seems like we’re onboarding anywhere from two to four, sometimes five a week every week.

Michelle Kesil (03:46)
Amazing and what markets are you operating in?

Steve Fingerman (03:49)
So we’re in Hernando County, which is Spring Hill, Florida. We’re probably about 45, 50 minutes north of Tampa. So we’re kind of removed from the metro area. We’re sort of a sleepy bedroom community. I say sleepy, but I have to be careful about saying that. I don’t want to offend anybody locally. But we have grown. The county has grown quite a bit and the community has grown. We’ve got a lot of commercial development going on that…

We’re starting to capture on the real estate side, which is really cool and a lot of building development a lot mean, there’s a new lagoon community going in right down the road on State Road 50 Which is going to house about 3,500 homes with one of the largest lagoons locally in our area first one to come to Hernando County so we’ve been meeting with a lot of those developers and builders and Looking what product they have they literally just opened up

So lot of exciting stuff going on here as far as development goes.

Michelle Kesil (04:50)
That’s great. So what caught my attention about you is the way that you’ve been able to really

put together all of these necessities for real estate with the agents and the loans and the titles and all of those offerings into one shop. Can you share a little bit about how you decided to do that and how you’ve been running that smoothly?

Steve Fingerman (06:03)
Sure, sure. I’d be happy to. So I started out in the mortgage business. ⁓ Very first loan I closed was in 1998, so it’s been a while. know, historically, loan officer chases realtor. Realtor refers to the loan officer, and that’s just a vicious cycle. And so a few years back, I decided that I think it would be better for all of us if we could integrate all that into…

one place and one stop shop. So we opened up People’s Trust Realty. We started with just a handful of agents. And the idea was to build the real estate brokerage around the lending part of the business because we had already gotten the lending part perfected by that point. And by doing that, we were able to offer a lot more value to our agents than what they typically were seeing.

Michelle Kesil (06:55)
Great. So yeah, how have you been running that smoothly with so many moving parts?

Steve Fingerman (07:01)
a lot of really good people on my side. Certainly I couldn’t do any of it without the support and the staff of the people that we have. We’ve managed to grow quite a bit, but we still very much have a very small family type of feel and atmosphere where everybody’s wanting to help each other. We have agents helping agents and we have loan officers helping agents and agents helping loan officers. Everybody wants to see everybody here succeed. So we’ve managed to build

a really good culture, which for me goes a really long way because without that and without everybody’s participation, I couldn’t possibly do what I’m doing.

Michelle Kesil (07:41)
Yeah, that’s so important to create that collaborative environment.

Steve Fingerman (07:47)
It really is. you know, the first few months of that were kind of challenging, right? Because as you grow, you’re always running into these sort of landmines. ⁓ But we’ve been lucky. I’ve been very fortunate to align with the right people and the right agents and the right groups of loan officers and support staff. And they’ve really helped us grow quite a bit.

Michelle Kesil (08:11)
Amazing. Yeah, so every operator I know had a moment in business where things felt more real, maybe a deal went sideways, or you just had to make a fast pivot. Do you mind sharing one of those experiences for you?

Steve Fingerman (08:30)
I mean, over the years, there’s been a lot of those, right? I mean, you look at just getting through the 2008 times, that was a pretty interesting time in itself. And we certainly pivoted a lot at that time period just to stay afloat and survive and be able to live to another day where we were able to do what we’re doing now was pretty amazing. The biggest thing I remember is coming in one day in 2008 and like losing a dozen banks in one day.

Michelle Kesil (08:33)
I’m sure, yeah.

Steve Fingerman (09:00)
with pending transactions at the closing table, finding out that not only are they not going to fund, but like there’s nobody on the other side to even answer the phone anymore. So that was pretty interesting. Luckily, when we had the first glimpse of it, ⁓ I sort of saw what was coming and we just transitioned and moved from the typical subprime stuff to FHA. At that time, I got my correspondent license.

and got approval through HUD, which at that point they were doing within 30 days. It was very quick. By the time things sort of really hit the fan and everybody caught on, that turn time got to like four or five months. So doing that ahead of time really saved us and allowed us to just continue doing business as usual. We almost didn’t miss a beat.

Michelle Kesil (09:52)
Yeah, that’s really important. It’s what separates the people that are here for that long-term vision.

Steve Fingerman (10:35)
Yeah, for sure, for sure. There was even a moment where we were doing a lot of down payment assistance loans back then. And I don’t know if you remember outfits like Nehemiah that offered the quote unquote seller funded down payment assistance. So that went away and everybody sort of scratched their head going, what’s next? Well, at that time, I’d come up with a sweat equity addendum because in the FHA guidelines, you’re allowed to use sweat equity.

And so what we did is we had a sweat equity agreement that a buyer and seller would negotiate out. And it gave them sort of some credit for what they would provide in the sweat equity. And we converted that to actual equity in the property that can be counted towards a down payment. So we put a few deals together that way as well. And that was a nice creative way to qualify somebody for the home, put them in and use their labor and their effort and their equity as

in exchange for the down payment and that made the deals work for a while.

Michelle Kesil (11:36)
Yeah, that’s important to know how to pivot and how to create the most profitable and best outcome for the clients.

Steve Fingerman (11:37)
So we’re used to pivoting.

Well, that’s the key, right? It’s to create the best outcome for the client. That’s what ultimately creates the profit for us as a business. And if we weren’t doing that, we probably wouldn’t be in business. So it’s nice to be able to do that for people.

Michelle Kesil (11:54)
Yeah.

Of course.

Yeah, that’s so important. So a lot of people that listen to this show are investors, maybe in the early stages. And yeah, you mentioned you do work with investors and have your own. Yeah, so can you share a little bit more about that process and expand on it?

Steve Fingerman (12:18)
We do.

Absolutely. So a good part of our business is actually doing just that working with early investors who are just sort of starting to get in, whether it be buy and hold or fix and flip. We do have access to a good number of fix and flip products where we’ll take a brand new investor that maybe has no experience, fund them 80 % of the purchase acquisition price, 100 % of the renovation. And we’ll do that all the way up to like 92 % loan to cost.

So it gives them the capital that they need to get into their first project. I personally do a lot of fix and flips myself. So I know a lot of the local contractors and vendors that you would need. ⁓ I’ve taken clients and sort of hooked them up with the right teams of people. And then we’ll personally review whatever project they bring in so that we can determine whether that’s going to be a viable flip for them or are they going to actually make any money.

Is it going to be a success or is it going to be a failure? Because the last thing we want to see is somebody new trying to get into this and making the wrong deal, buying the wrong property and just not making any money or even worse being stuck with it at the end in a challenging market where maybe the cash flow isn’t going to be there if they have to convert to a long-term hold. So we want to try to help our people avoid all that.

Michelle Kesil (13:47)
Yeah, that’s so important to see how you can support people that are learning and just starting out and avoiding those common obstacles.

Steve Fingerman (13:58)
that is really important. We never

want anybody to right? Especially if we’re involved in the transaction.

Michelle Kesil (14:03)
Yeah.

Yeah, what would you say some of those common obstacles or like misconceptions are that might cause people to like stumble versus succeed in those early stages?

Steve Fingerman (14:21)
You know, and this is funny, like TV sort of ruins everything, right? And you have all these shows on HGTV that make it look easy and people are doing these flips in seven days, but reality is you’re probably not gonna do a whole lot of work in seven days time. It’s gonna take longer than seven days. In most cases, just to close on the darn property.

The biggest thing I would say is,

Be very careful on the acquisition, right? There’s an old saying that your money is made on the buy, not on the sell. And if you buy it wrong, you’re going to have a really tough time all the way through. So we want to really carefully analyze what the acquisition looks like,

how much spread there really is, what the property is going to

And then also be cognizant that you have to have a contingency plan. There has to be more than one exit strategy. And you also have to plan for unforeseen and unknown things that

come up like, you gonna open up this wall and find a whole bunch of wood rot and all of sudden you have to replace that whole exterior wall, including stuccoing, where you were never budgeting and planning for that and that might set you back 70, 500, 12, 10,000, who knows how much, right? So there has to be enough there in your acquisition where you can afford to absorb all those things that are unforeseen and still be profitable.

Michelle Kesil (16:23)
Yeah, I think that’s something people should really take note of. Awesome. So let me ask you this. What are you most focused on solving or scaling next?

Steve Fingerman (16:38)
Right now we’re heavily focused on scaling the real estate business in terms of agent acquisition. And that’s just because I see a huge opportunity there for agents. ⁓ A lot of agents that I know personally are just getting tired of paying the high fees that are brokerages. ⁓ I think that some of those days are numbered for a lot of these sort of loaded type of brokerages or arrangements.

There was a time where that was what you had. But with technology and we use a lot of technology in our business to be able to minimize our costs, we can really offer a lot more value for a lot less money. And oftentimes they get more value with me than they were getting at your big box brand, just because of all the things that we provide. So you can continue to pay your brokerage 20 % of your money.

or you can come here where you get 100 % and all I take is $295. And what makes that work is that we have the ancillary businesses to surround it, right? So as long as we’re getting and capturing some of the mortgage and the title business, we’re profitable and we’re making money and we’re able to pass that value down to our agents.

Michelle Kesil (17:54)
Yeah, that’s such a high level and unique business model. I feel like not many businesses are doing it like that. How did you like innovate this model?

Steve Fingerman (18:09)
I did it completely backwards from everybody else, right? So normally somebody will open a real estate office and then the afterthought is, well, let me add a mortgage company or a mortgage lender and it’s usually not their company, not their business. they don’t necessarily have the knowledge that you need to run a mortgage business. So you’re relying on somebody else coming into your existing company.

Michelle Kesil (18:12)
Yeah.

Steve Fingerman (18:35)
⁓ And now you’re at the mercy of their service levels, their underwriting, their knowledge, their responsiveness. We did this completely backwards. We spent years and years perfecting the mortgage business. Once we had that down is when I decided to build and scale the real estate business around that. So we’re total opposite of what everybody else has historically done.

Michelle Kesil (19:01)
Wow, love that. So, what is that next real goal for you?

Steve Fingerman (19:09)
Well, we’re missing a little bit still. So, you my concept is I want truly a one stop shop solution. I want you to be able to come here and get everything you need at the best value, the best cost and the best service level. we have mortgage real estate and title, we’re missing insurance. So for me, next piece of the puzzle is to add an insurance company to the mix. ⁓ Me and my partner in the title business, Patrick Kander working on that right now.

And we’re actually hoping to launch that, let’s say reasonably in the next 90 days. Our goal is sooner than 90 days, but I’ll reasonably say up to 90 days just in case. Again, we find something that we didn’t foresee in terms of a hurdle in opening and launching. But within the next three months, we’ll have an insurance company.

Michelle Kesil (20:00)
very exciting. Awesome. So yeah, like I mentioned, a lot of people listening to the show are either earlier in their journey or they’re just looking to level up and I think they’d benefit from hearing this. When it comes to building relationships and growing your network, what has made the biggest difference for you?

Steve Fingerman (20:01)
No, it is.

The biggest difference is, well, first of all, get out there, right? Go shake hands, meet as many people as you can. ⁓ Obviously be very genuine people. And I approach things probably a lot differently. I look at things in the nature of how can I help someone else first before it benefits me? And that in turn has benefited me tremendously over the years.

Michelle Kesil (20:54)
Yeah, absolutely.

Steve Fingerman (20:54)
It isn’t

necessarily about making money from a connection, it’s about helping that connection. And if you make other people money, they’ll make you money in return.

Michelle Kesil (21:04)
Yeah, relationships and service are the most important thing in this space.

Steve Fingerman (21:11)
Absolutely. And if you’re just starting out as a new investor, build your team. Get people around you that are really good at what they do. ⁓ know, the old saying, you don’t want to be the smartest person in the room. So definitely surround yourself with some really smart people that have done exactly what you’re trying to do, have a proven track record of success at it. Like for me, I don’t just do lending in real estate. I also invest.

So I’ve come through those hurdles that people face. I’ve made bad decisions. Not every decision is a good decision, right? And I’ve had the unfortunate experience of doing a deal where I lost some money. And so I could pass that knowledge down to everybody that I work with. And that’s important. You need to really work with people that have an understanding of what you’re going to be going through and what you’re facing that can help you not only avoid it, but get through it if it happens and also scale your business so that you can grow it.

Like one flip a year is nice. 20 is a lot better. So work with people that can get you there and help you achieve all your goals.

Michelle Kesil (22:20)
Yeah, that’s very crucial. How has your investor journey been? I’m sure there’s a piece of advice you can offer.

Steve Fingerman (22:30)
It’s been a very interesting ride for sure. The best piece of advice I can give goes right back to the basics. It really starts with your acquisition. Be smart about what you’re buying. Study your market. Understand and know what your market times are, what your days of market are going to look like. Don’t think just about landing the deal. Land the right deal and then think about what your exit strategy is going to be.

Ideally right now I’m advising that you get in a position where you can ultimately come through your renovations, rehab, everything else and be priced ultimately a little bit below that market so that you’re getting more eyes on your property in a quicker turnaround because for us as investors, that’s the name of the game, right? I want in and out as quickly as I can. I don’t want to sit on the market for the 96 day average market time. I want a contract in 30 days or less.

Ideally a week to ten days the only way I’m going to accomplish that right now is to be about four or five percent Below what the comp say and we see when we do that that pricing strategy right now works really well We sell very very quickly when we’re at comp or above comp because we want to get all the money Those are the properties that sit a lot longer and it takes a lot longer to recapture your capital If you’re paying underlying financing on that you end up losing more money anyway by the time it sells so just

Be smart about really buying in how you’re going to exit it. Those are crucial. Those two points right now are very crucial.

Michelle Kesil (24:07)
Absolutely, thank you for sharing that. All right, so before we wrap up here, if someone wants to reach out to you, connect, collaborate, or just learn more about what you’re doing, what’s the best way for them to reach you?

Steve Fingerman (24:23)
So they can call me directly. always give out my cell number. I’m an open book. You can call me anytime. My cell is 727-946-0904. And they can also find us online. Our website is www.ourteamrocks.com.

Michelle Kesil (24:44)
Well, listen, I appreciate your time, your story and perspective. We need more people in this space who are doing innovative things. So thank you for being here.

Steve Fingerman (24:55)
Thank you, thank you for having me. It was really a pleasure.

Michelle Kesil (24:58)
Absolutely. And for those of you tuning in, if you got value from this, make sure you’re subscribed. We’ve got more conversations coming with operators just like Steve, who are out here building real businesses. And we’ll see you all in the next episode.