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Show Summary
In this episode, real estate investor Nick Korwin shares his journey from engineering to successful short-term rental entrepreneur. Discover his strategies for market differentiation, micro-resort development, and effective marketing to maximize profitability and mitigate risks.
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Nick Korwin (00:00)
The Dells has a ⁓ ton of resorts already, like I mentioned, millions of people come and ⁓ those resorts are a lot of fun. They’re a lot of family-focused fun. They’re waterpark-based ⁓ and they’re looking to get as many people in as they possibly can per square foot and I’m doing the opposite with my resorts. There’s no waterpark there. It’s very nature-focused. It’s 40 acres of woods and miles of trails.
Scott Bursey (01:56)
Welcome back to the Real Estate Pros Podcast, dedicated to giving you, the real estate professional, the strategies you need to dominate your market. I’m your host, Scott Bursey. And today we have a very special guest and it’s going to be a pleasure to welcome Nick Korwin. Nick, welcome to the show.
Nick Korwin (02:16)
Yeah, thanks so much Scott. Pleasure to be here.
Scott Bursey (02:19)
Yes it is. And for our listeners who may not be familiar with your journey, please tell us, how did your career begin and what’s your main focus now, Nick?
Nick Korwin (02:29)
Yeah, certainly. Out of school, I was an engineer by background and I worked my way through a lot of different jobs in manufacturing and ended up now in tech. I still have my day job, but I started investing on the side about five years ago into real estate. Started off with long-term renting and moved my way into short-term renting, so like Airbnbs. I own two of those and I since started a micro-resort build, which I’m sure we’ll get into.
three cabins on 40 acres.
The short-term rentals I own are in central Wisconsin, a small town called the Wisconsin Dells. 3,000 people but they invite five million visitors a year. It’s a tourist town. I’m ⁓ looking to hitch a ride onto ⁓ that train there with my hospitality venues. So that’s what I’m doing these days.
Scott Bursey (04:10)
Well, absolutely. And what a great area to hitch your train onto. And hopefully you can really steer that train in a great direction. Nick, let me ask you this. What are some core strengths that you provide to the market right now as it relates to your business?
Nick Korwin (04:31)
Taking my skill set from my career, one of the biggest things I brought into investing was my operator mindset. ⁓ Looking for efficiencies everywhere I can and short-term rentals, each one you own is very much an operational activity. It’s hard to scale those. There’s a lot of unique, especially as you move into different markets, but if you can stay in the same market, you can
try your best to make it efficient. that’s one thing I brought in and from a market in terms of like what the hospitality market itself is looking for and what I bring. I look to stay on if you think of the type of offerings that are in a market for hospitality like a bell curve.
I try to stay on the edges of the bell curve, more on the niche. So I really try to, that’s where you can get higher margins and higher occupancy a lot of times if you’re doing it right, because you’re focusing in on a specific clientele. So really that’s what I try to do with all of my properties in my market as
Scott Bursey (05:36)
That’s so smart. Let’s talk about the resort for a little bit. What ⁓ are you going to offer that may separate you apart from your standard accommodations there at Wisconsin Dells and that sort of thing.
Nick Korwin (05:50)
Yeah, so
Dells has a ⁓ ton of resorts already, like I mentioned, millions of people come and ⁓ those resorts are a lot of fun. They’re a lot of family-focused fun. They’re waterpark-based
and they’re looking to get as many people in as they possibly can per square foot and I’m doing the opposite with my resorts. There’s no waterpark there. It’s very nature-focused. It’s 40 acres of woods and miles of trails.
⁓ sauna, hot tub, per cabin, right? So I’m looking the opposite way trying to really drive rest and relaxation and wellness focus for my guests who want to get out of the hustle and bustle. They may want to go to the water park for the day or maybe want to do our tourist trap activity which is all good, it’s all fun, ⁓ but then they can come back to my place and my cabins and really get that relaxation that we all need from time to time.
That’s really how I’m trying to set myself apart from the rest of the market there.
Scott Bursey (07:22)
makes a lot of sense. Separate yourself from the hustle bustle where somebody can have a bonfire and just gaze at the wilderness and then take a nature walk. ⁓ How cool, that’s really cool. What sort of opportunities do you see in your market right now as well as it pertains to the short-term rentals?
Nick Korwin (07:35)
Yeah, definitely.
Yeah, I think it’s again kind of on the edge of the bell curve. So like the most common offering and most secondary and tertiary markets, these smaller towns, when you get out of the big urban areas, are single-family homes. That’s what everyone has and that’s what it’s the easiest way to offer as an Airbnb. So those three, four-bedroom places. ⁓ It’s really hard to stand out there and it’s super competitive. And so like
If you’re in a market like Florida, for example, you’re constantly cannibalizing yourself and just having to re-up your amenities every year and get new things. And so I’m trying to get out of that rat race almost, if you call it that. So I see opportunities on the small one or two bedroom, highly focused
Scott Bursey (08:14)
Ahem.
Nick Korwin (08:36)
I’m looking high-end luxury, romantic getaway with my micro resort, but my other two Airbnbs in town are six-bedroom, up to 20 people ⁓ stays, and so it’s more multiple families or bachelor parties or things like that, golf trips. So there’s not a lot of opportunity, not a lot of ⁓ volume in terms of ⁓ places to stay.
in the market there for those niche opportunities. So that’s where I’m trying to come in and make a move.
Scott Bursey (09:06)
Sure.
The competition is certainly understandable. Is there a part of your business that you feel that you may double down on here in the next, ⁓ let’s say five to 10 years?
Nick Korwin (10:03)
Yeah, I think the micro resort provides a perfect opportunity for that. So with ⁓ the 40 acres, I have three cabins that I’m building, launching July 1st, hopefully, if not sooner.
have the opportunity to expand and still provide a level of privacy and intimacy with nature. So I think that’s a really good opportunity to potentially double down. So building maybe two or three more or something like that. I’ll never have 20 cabins on site. I’m not going to pack them in like the rest of the resorts do in town. I’m always going to have that, but ⁓ that’s definitely an area where I think it makes a logical sense to expand.
Scott Bursey (10:41)
Absolutely, anything in regards to market risk perhaps.
Nick Korwin (10:47)
Yeah, you mean in terms of how that expansion might change or ⁓ yeah, sure.
Scott Bursey (10:53)
Yes, and what your strategy may be in place
to tackle something of risk down the road. What kind of safeguards do you have in place?
Nick Korwin (11:04)
Yeah, no, that’s a good call. I think it all starts with when you buy a property or when you underwrite it. A lot of times deals are bad from the get-go and so I really try to provide a level
conservatism in my numbers I’m penciling out and make sure that I have a very low floor in terms of what my debt load will cost.
which is usually the biggest load on your operation. that’s one thing I definitely try to do. Another thing is, ⁓ I’m on each end of the bell curve, so I got big stays in downtown. I have the micro resort, which is one and two bedroom stays out of town. ⁓ So I’m diversifying there in the short-term space. And what’s nice about being in a regional market like the Dells, where I’m a couple hours from Chicago, Milwaukee, Minneapolis,
⁓ It’s a mid-market even in terms of tourism. as maybe if there was going to be a recession, let’s say ⁓ hopefully years down the road, but if there was one, I guess that might not fly to the coast or might not fly to the Gulf or something. Maybe they’re going to look to drive. So now they’re going to be going to the Dells for their summer vacation instead of driving. So the market will shift but the demand ⁓
for what I need. I don’t need 100,000 people coming to my resort, I just need 1,000 people. So, I think as the clientele shift or the demand shifts, I’m still in a really good place, ⁓ regardless.
Scott Bursey (12:39)
Absolutely, and how are you going to be marketing?
Nick Korwin (12:39)
You
Yeah, so I’m gonna
The best hospitality unique stays really focus on direct booking. So there’s a couple different ways to go about that. ⁓ You want to Airbnb and Berbo, booking.com, they’re great sites. They drive a ton of the band. They’re going to get your place booked if you have a good stay, but they take their cut. So you’re 15, 20 % off the top and that’s a ton of margin. So if I can book direct, I can get at least half of that, if not more of that back. And so I’m going to drive people
⁓ My goal is through Instagram and TikTok ⁓ dominate short form video, ⁓ use a marketing agency to help me get my resort off the ground and get some really good content out there for people to book because you’ll also when you’re on Instagram or TikTok scrolling you’re not price shopping. You’re going to find my place in an emotional state where you’re like wow I love this, this looks awesome.
not comparing it to something down the road in that moment and so ⁓ you can drive a lot of higher rates as well incidentally because of that.
Scott Bursey (13:48)
Certainly, and how far is your resort from the greater Chicago area?
Nick Korwin (13:53)
Yeah, it’s about two hours or so, maybe two and a half from O’Hare. yeah, it’s definitely within driving distance if people were to fly in, even less if you’re looking at ⁓ Minneapolis, Milwaukee, Madison, the regional areas as well.
Scott Bursey (14:10)
What an intriguing spot and that resort sounds really, really cool. What would you like our listeners to ⁓ walk away with as far as what would you like them to know about the resort and your other short-term rentals?
Nick Korwin (14:20)
Yeah.
Yeah, and so, you know, the resort name is Oak and Ember. I encourage people to go check it out. My website is stayoakandember.com. I also post a lot of videos online about me building the resort and getting into trouble in the construction. So you can always check out my personal videos. ⁓ @korwinning, it’s a play on my last name. Anywhere you want to check out online. I’m really active on LinkedIn as well. So, you know, I’m trying to be out there as much as I can for folks. But, you know, what I want people
know about the resort. I’m launching July 1st if not sooner and if you want something high-end, ⁓ yeah if you want something high-end, luxury, ⁓ wellness feel to it, ⁓ know and want to get out of the headlines of AI and technology and all this doomerism that’s out there like come to my place and really reset. So that’s what we’re trying to build.
Scott Bursey (15:20)
Absolutely, how exciting, July 1st.
Nick Korwin (15:23)
That’s right. Yep, hopefully sooner, but that’s what I’m doing.
Scott Bursey (15:25)
Nick. Yes. Nick
Korwin, everybody. And make sure that you check out the resort. I know that I’m going to check into it. Thank you for joining us here today, Nick.
Nick Korwin (15:37)
Thanks a lot, Scott, I appreciate it.
Scott Bursey (15:39)
This has been an absolute pleasure. And for our listeners, we appreciate you. If you got value out of today’s episode, please subscribe. We have more conversations coming up with exceptional operators, just like Nick. Until next time, keep your standards high and your vision clear. We’ll see you on the next episode, everyone.
