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Show Summary
In this episode of the Real Estate Pros Podcast, host Micah Johnson speaks with Conner Kinney, a young real estate investor who began his journey at just 19 years old. Conner shares his experiences in the real estate market, with a strong focus on creative financing strategies, the importance of networking, and the transition from smaller properties to larger multifamily investments. He emphasizes the value of education, taking action, and building meaningful relationships within the industry. Conner also discusses the ideal characteristics of sellers suited for financing and offers encouragement to aspiring investors.
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Investor Fuel Show Transcript:
Conner Kinney (00:00)
My biggest thing is lack of capital when I was first getting started. So what I enjoyed about seller financing is I was able to get these sellers to finance me 90, 95 % of the deal. So then that left me not having to come up with 25 or 30%, but maybe coming up with five or 10%. So great example, one of the deals I just did, I was able to negotiate 2 % down, which is incredible.Micah Johnson (01:59)
Hey everyone, welcome to the real estate pros podcast. I’m your host, Micah Johnson. And today I’m speaking with Conner Kinney, who’s taken real estate investing by the horn since he was 19. So I’m excited to dig in with him today. Conner, welcome in man. Glad to have you.Conner Kinney (02:13)
Micah, you get to be with ya. So pumped for this, gonna be fun.Micah Johnson (02:17)
Absolutely, man. I’m excited for today. I love getting folks on the show that take action, that one of my favorite quotes I hear is, know, you don’t have resources, be resourceful. And so I’m excited to dig in with that with you and talk about what folks can hear and how to make sure you take advantage of an incredible opportunity like real estate is. So for folks who may not know you yet, what’s your main focus right now and what markets do you operate in?Conner Kinney (02:41)
Yeah, our main focus, we are buying typically smaller multifamily duplexes, fourplexes. We like portfolios, so we’ll buy multifamily portfolios. And then we’re actually looking at some smaller apartment complexes right now in the 20 to 50 unit range. And we are based out of Fort Worth, Texas, so we’re buying in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. We’re also buying in Bryan and College Station, Texas, where Texas A &M University is. We’ve got a portfolio there as well.Micah Johnson (03:09)
Love that man, great spots to be in, great spots. So back us up a little bit. How’d you get to real estate? What led you to this industry specifically?Conner Kinney (03:18)
Yeah, so when I graduated high school, was kind of shoved down your throat. You had to go to college. You get this magic four year piece of paper when you graduate and you’re supposed to be successful. And that just never really kind of lit a fire in me. And so I actually, you know, went to school for two semesters and then I actually dropped out because I had read this book called the Rich Dad Poor Dad by Robert Kiyosaki. And it was kind of telling you, hey,you gotta buy these assets, you stay away from liabilities. And I was like, that’s cool. If I just buy rental properties, you know, that makes a lot of sense. So I started working for a real estate investor on the side while I was actually still going to school. And ultimately I was having so much fun working with him and he kind of taught me how to invest in real estate. so shortly after that, I decided, hey, I’m going to drop out of school and go full time into real estate. And I bought my first duplex shortly after at 19 years old. And that’s kind of what got my start.
Micah Johnson (04:15)
Love that man. How’d you meet that person that was investing already?Conner Kinney (04:18)
Yeah, so Iactually, I just did a Google search. This is before, you know, Chad GPT. I did a little Google search and said, hey, top real estate investors, you know, close to me. And somehow a real estate event popped up. So I thought, man, I’ll go to this real estate event. So I sat on the front row and just started networking and that really opened a door. And I ended up sitting next to a guy who introduced me.
to another guy and so I ended up working for him and he had a couple hundred units and so it was a real blessing to get to work for him and kind of, you know, be in the trenches a little bit and really understand the business.
Micah Johnson (04:57)
I love that man. I say a lot on this show. Education is always step number one.We all want to write the offer, but that’s like step 10 in the process. There’s a lot of things that happened before that. And so if you’re listening or watching, take note of how Conner took action. You went and found a place, you found an event. I’m very big on getting in rooms with people because it’s where you make connections. Real estate’s a relationship business. ⁓
And you don’t, it’s a team sport. You can’t do it alone. Like you can literally cannot buy a property alone. You have to have at least an attorney, a title company, somebody to help you with it. So this is very much an industry where you got to get out there and meet folks. So good job on that, man. So when that led you to doing your own thing, what lessons did you take away that helps you get on your feet and rolling?
Conner Kinney (06:35)
Yeah, you know, I really learned how important managing the properties are. So it’s one thing to buy them, but it’s another thing to really manage them. I self manage, we self manage our portfolio today still. And it’s really understanding, hey, how to take care of your residents, how to lease properly. And then also he did a lot of creative structures as well. So that taught me and what we’ll get into later about seller financing, how to be creative using other people’s money, how to do he does a lot ofFix and flips as well. how to do fix and flips use that money to then put it back into rental properties. So it was a lot of being in the business, not just kind of surface level education, but hey, really how does somebody operate their business and how can I take that and use it in my business? And really that’s you talked about it taking action. That’s really what what led me to take an action. It was I was around other people who were buying real estate. And so it kind of rubbed off on me like, hey, if these guys can do it, sure, I can do it. So
I would encourage anybody, just get around people who are doing the thing you want to do and it really does rub off on you and give you some encouragement to go after.
Micah Johnson (07:43)
There’s a reason people say you are who you surround yourself with. That is not just a cliché. It is very much true. It’s more than like, does it make you a good person or not? Does it help you achieve what you’re trying to do? Are you surrounding yourself with the folks that are doing the things you’re doing, are ahead of you, where you can maintain a little humility and keep learning? That’s what I notice the best do. The guys and girls that have been doing this for decades and are extremely good at it.They’re still in the rooms learning every chance they get because real estate doesn’t stop changing, right? It’s always different. There’s different regulations. There’s an unless you’re in it day in and day out, you don’t know what’s changing. And there’s a, see a lot of coaches now that coach, but don’t do real estate anymore. It’s like, well, what do you teach them? Like how to do it years ago? Like, I’m not sure what you’re saying to them because unless you’re doing it right now and understanding, especially in these kinds of market types, when we get squeezed,
Conner Kinney (08:30)
No.Micah Johnson (08:41)
The best rise to the top, it forces you to look at holes in your business, areas where 20 to 2022, man, a lot of folks look like geniuses out there where it was just riding the market, where you’re just riding it up, it’s not really you, you’re just in it at the right time. So I love that, that even at your age that you’re starting to see, hey, get in these rooms with people, be around folks who know what they’re doing. And you got led to it the same way most of us did by that little purple Bible.that Robert wrote years ago. ⁓ It is definitely one of the most common things that made folks go, huh. I remember when I read it, though, I was a realtor at the time and I just started working with investors and an investor gave it to me, he was from Australia and I was like, dude, what is this? Let me know about it, this is cool. And it just, it opens your mind up, man. And even like you said, you start to believe you can.
Conner Kinney (09:30)
Yeah.Micah Johnson (09:36)
Like there’s always that moment where you’re, this for me or not? I’m not sure. And then you get into those rooms and you realize these aren’t special people in any sense that are pulling this off. They’re just folks who dedicated themselves to it.Conner Kinney (09:48)
Yeah, it’s justgetting, I mean, get around people who are doing what you want to do and it really does rub off on you and give you some encouragement to go take action.
Micah Johnson (09:57)
I love that man. All right, let’s get into that creative financing part, because that’s something that you learn from him.And a lot of investors deal with this, but especially at a younger age, you deal with this, which is that lack of capital. How do you actually get that deal? So how have you leveraged creative into creating your portfolio?
Conner Kinney (10:49)
Yeah, so you know with you know with a bank loan typically they’re going to lend you maybe 70 to 75 % LTV loan to value. So with seller financing to keep it simple seller financing all it is is instead of you paying a bank every month you’re paying the seller they become the bank. So what’s fun about it is a bank you’re kind of in this box and you cannot negotiate with the bank on their interest rate their term.what the term sheet the bank gives you says, that’s what goes. With seller financing, it’s all negotiable. So you can negotiate a lower down payment. Let’s say they are stuck on a purchase price and you’re like, hey, I can’t make this purchase price work at the interest rates right now. But maybe you say, hey, if we can do a little lower interest rate, I can make the deal work. So you can negotiate and kind of move pieces around to make deals work. And ultimately,
My biggest thing is lack of capital when I was first getting started. So what I enjoyed about seller financing is I was able to get these sellers to finance me 90, 95 % of the deal. So then that left me not having to come up with 25 or 30%, but maybe coming up with five or 10%. So great example, one of the deals I just did, I was able to negotiate 2 % down, which is
So.
you’re a little higher leverage obviously, but ultimately it gives you the ability to get into a deal where you might not have been able to get into a deal. And so that’s what’s been super fun is, you I have a lot of deals where I’ve got lower interest rates. mean, crazy low down payments. And so it’s just fun because then you can cashflow more. You’re able to kind of grow your portfolio a little quicker versus putting 20, 30 % down on all these deals. And there’s no…
It’s very easy to work because there’s no qualifications. You don’t have to have a W-2. You don’t have to have a crazy good credit score. There’s really no qualifications at all. It’s just whatever you can negotiate with that seller. And it’s all about trust. You have to develop trust and rapport with them. And every seller I do this with, I go to coffee with them or lunch with them and we talk about it. But ultimately, if you can get the trust, you can get terms that nobody else can get.
Micah Johnson (13:09)
Right now tell us a little bit about who’s the ideal seller that seller finances is there any particular traits about them where you if you’re talking to one you like this could be a good thing to mention.Conner Kinney (13:21)
Yeah, good question. there there are and what I call them is retiring landlords. So retiring landlords are typically older people anywhere. I mean from you know, 5560 plus years old that are have been in the business for a little while have typically their properties are paid off so they don’t owe anything on them and typically they’re getting older and they’re like, hey, I don’t really need the money. I really like the cash flow butI hate dealing with tenants, toilets, and termites and managing. This is not fun, but I like the cash flow. I step in and to me, everything I do, I just try to be a solution to someone’s problem. So I see their problem and I go, hey, let me, I’ll give you a little down payment. I’ll give you this price and I’ll just make you payments monthly and you don’t have to deal with anything.
And so they really like that because even though they might get a little bit less than what they were getting before on a monthly basis, it’s pure cash flow. And so I get to take it over. I can do a lot of value add projects. A lot of time when these people get older, they can’t necessarily do a lot of things themselves. So the properties kind of start deteriorating. So if you can go in there, you know, just make a monthly payments and then you can do the value add and ultimately get great terms. It’s a great win win for both parties because they’re happy because
they don’t have to manage anything and they just get a monthly check every month. And so that’s why they like it. I have several sellers who are, mean, they’ll probably pass away before my note comes due and so it’ll go to their kids. So that’s another reason they like it is because then they kind of set up their kids for success as well, which is super cool.
Micah Johnson (14:49)
Right.Yeah, man, and that’s where I’ve seen it work too, is that cash flow stage. They’re not after what we’re after anymore. It’s something different. They did that part, they pulled it off. And like you said, they’re just kind of tired. They don’t want to do it anymore. That little bit, their time freedom is way more important to them at that point because the financial freedom has been created. That’s not the issue anymore. They have that. And like you said, they’re willing to take that little bit less per month because the amount of time they get to their life back.
They feel like they’re making money and they are still making money, but it feels even more so because, you know, there’s no more tenants, toilets and trash that they got to deal with like you were talking
Conner Kinney (16:27)
That’s exactly right. It’s a lot less stressful for them as well. Another benefit is, and I’m not a CPA, but there is some tax reasons as well. I think they can defer a lot of their capital gains taxes as well when they carry the note like that. So that’s another reason as well. A lot of them like it.Micah Johnson (16:45)
Yep, that big lump sum doesn’t come at them and they have to give up 60 % of it or whatever it is when they get hammered there. So it is.Conner Kinney (16:50)
Yeah, exactly.These are not small numbers. So yeah, I mean, it can be a lot of money and a lot of savings to them.
Micah Johnson (16:58)
Right, right. So tell us about 2026. What are you excited for this year? What do feel like your big opportunity is?Conner Kinney (17:04)
Yeah, this year I think we’re being more aggressive with some bigger multifamily. I’m taking the everything I’ve done is off market direct to seller. So I’m taking that and trying to move it into bigger 20 to 50 unit property. So finding what we just talked about, mom and pop retiring landlords who own maybe a 20 unit, a 30 unit, a 40 unit who are at that phase of life where, hey, I want to move on from this thing.We don’t necessarily want to sell it outright for cash, but we need someone to come along. So really targeting those opportunities, I think is huge right now. There’s a lot of them that are kind of starting to go down and because these sellers are getting too old to take care of them. And so if we can then add a bunch of value to them and ultimately get, get rents up, get the value back up and improve some of these properties. I think there’s a ton of value right there. And I’m seeing it in the market. We’re working on a couple of deals right now where it’s that same.
situation and so really doubling down on those.
Micah Johnson (18:06)
doing these smaller, the duplexes, fourplexes, and think you said you own a 12plex currently as well. How has that prepared you for these bigger deals?Conner Kinney (18:14)
Yeah, you know, I think we’re really management heavy. And so I think just managing is the most important thing. And so, hey, it’s the same principles when you buy a duplex versus when you buy a 50 unit. I mean, it’s just bigger. And what I’ve learned is you make more money when you do the bigger deals. And so if I can do a bigger deal and it’s really not a…much more work than me buying one duplexes versus me buying like the 12 unit I bought. It was the same amount of work. And so I’m going, hey, if I can, you know, not just buy a 12 unit, but if I can go buy a 24 unit or a 50 unit, you know that the reward is much higher and the work. Yes, it is a little bit more work and it’s definitely more difficult, but it’s not so much so that it’s not worth it. I think there’s a ton of benefit there and, and I have a ton of confidence from managing my duplexes, my four plexes.
my 12 plex. mean, really, if you look at it together, our portfolio is one big complex pretty much. So I’m going, if I can manage this and lead it to success, then I can totally manage a bigger project.
Micah Johnson (19:23)
Yeah man, you start in those larger units, they let you play in the economies of scale. Where like you’re saying, when you can pick up 20 to 50 doors at once, yeah, you got substantially more work in front of you, but it’s not that much different than the work you were already doing. It’s super valuable to have done it before, right? If you buy a 50 out of the gate and don’t know what you’re doing, that’s not my first recommendation. I don’t recommend folks do that, go learn on something, because those are big numbers you could.Conner Kinney (19:47)
Yeah.Micah Johnson (19:51)
You could possibly mess up on a little bit, but that’s true, man. When you can move up into that, again, the economies of scale where it exists to make more money at a quicker pace, because real estate is not really a get rich quick scheme. You can get wealthy faster though, if you start playing in certain areas, you just got to know what you’re doing when you get there. Because that’s the, when the numbers get bigger, your chances of, if it doesn’t work,they can knock you out of the game more. So making sure you’re in a place where that can’t happen, that’s the key to real estate that I’ve learned is, you know, focus on singles and doubles and you’ll hit plenty of home runs. But if you only focus on home runs, man, you’re gonna be going home losing fast.
Conner Kinney (20:34)
Yeah.Yeah, exactly.
Micah Johnson (20:40)
So in your couple of years, in the few years that you’ve done this, what would you encourage somebody that’s on the sidelines like yourself thinking about it, maybe interested, could even be in that position where they’re in college. What do they need to think about before making that decision? What should they be contemplating? And then if it’s there, make the jump.Conner Kinney (21:04)
My advice, Micah would be, you know, don’t let fear hold you back. You know, I think a lot of people think you got to have a ton of capital, you have to have a ton of experience. And, you know, I didn’t have any of that. I don’t have any family in real estate when I first got started or anything. So I would encourage you just taking action has really been a benefit. And we spoke about this earlier in the podcast is hey, just go take action and good things happen. And I’m not saying be reckless, but go take action.And so if you see an opportunity that might be a decent property, you know, go take the action and go look at it. Because what I learned is when I bought that first duplex at 19, I was super nervous. I had no idea what I was doing. But ultimately I look back and I’m going, wow, I’ve grown so much since then. And every property I buy, Micah, I get a little bit better. I get a little bit more confident and I learn a little bit more. So I think you won’t know everything. think people think
I’m just gonna magically know everything and then I’ll get started and that’s not how it works. I’m still trying to figure out some things in my business and that’s just the reality of it. And so if you can say, hey, I am going to be comfortable with not knowing everything, I’m just gonna put my best foot forward and take action, I think it’ll lead you to a lot of success.
Micah Johnson (22:23)
agree, man. I agree. least that reminds me of one of my favorite quotes by Virginia Satir. And she says, most people prefer the certainty of misery than the misery of uncertainty. And if you can stomach that second one, if you can just be okay with not knowing some things and then getting going on the way, that’s where the magic happens. I call it getting in the way of opportunity is how do you go put yourself in the way of it? And like you did, the first thing you did was Googled something.Right. And that’s where I want folks to hear the action isn’t like this big thing. It’s just as simple as searching up real estate meetups near me, real estate events near me, investors near me. That’s like step one. Then step two is show up, a phone call, go build those relationships. Right. Don’t get discouraged if the first few people you meet aren’t the right ones. Just keep going. Cause like what happened to you.
The guy sitting beside you wasn’t the one, it was the one he introduced you to. So that is where, man, real estate is this team sport where just by meeting people, putting folks in your phone, you have no idea what’s gonna happen next. And real estate’s huge. Like you were able to get into it, meet a good investor, find the area you liked. Same, that’s available to anybody that wants to get in. Just do those parts up front. That’s why I’m huge on masterminds and belonging to groups because
There’s a reason there’s people are there. There’s a reason they do that. And I have found in my career, I’ve been doing it 14 years, the best don’t stop doing it. They all belong to stuff. The top ones are always connected with other people. I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, he does way more than a hundred deals a year. And I was asking him, you know, why do you stay? Why do you stay in these events? He goes, man, because one, you’re working with a whole bunch of people who keep their ear to the ground.
That’s what’s good about relationships. You can call, hey, what do you notice? What are you seeing? And then two, you hear about stuff way before other people. Different softwares, different things coming out that they don’t go mainstream for two or three years after you hear about them in these places. And one of them he was introduced to at the last event. He’s made a few hundred thousand dollars off of it already. And it’s like, that’s why. That’s what that can do for you by just putting yourself in that position.
Conner Kinney (24:24)
Yeah.on how.
Micah Johnson (24:45)
to meet people.Conner Kinney (24:46)
Yeah, I just think if you can take action and really, you know, don’t think of yourself as a real estate investor or aspiring real estate investor. Think of yourself as an opportunist. How can I create an opportunity for myself? Everything I’ve done has ultimately come down to just creating opportunities out of thin air. And so for someone getting started, especially if you’re young, I mean, if you’re young, you know, people love to help out younger folks. And so if you can go, go put yourself out there, go.give some value, go create an opportunity and good things happen.
Micah Johnson (25:21)
The way you did it is one I highly recommend. If you have the opportunity, get work in the business. Go work in it first. Go work for somebody else that’s doing it at a high level to let you earn them paycheck, keep your life going. But at the same time, you’re getting that education that you were trying to get in college just now, it’s in real life. It’s on the ground and you’re getting paid to get it instead of paying to get it, which is pretty handy. And it just sets you up, man. The information is out there.Conner Kinney (25:40)
Yeah.Yes.
Micah Johnson (25:51)
Go get around the folks that have it. Conner, man, I really appreciate your time today, your story, your perspective, man. I think more folks need to get out there and do it like you’re doing it. Just take that action. And I think you’ve built something for folks to help them with that, right? What do you have available for folks that want to find out more about you and learn what you have going on?Conner Kinney (26:11)
Yeah, Micah, if they want to go to my website, connerkinney.com, it’s C-O-N-N-E-R-K-I-N-N-E-Y.com. We’ve created a five-step guide to get their first deal. You can go download it on my website for free.Micah Johnson (26:26)
Awesome, Excellent. We’ll make sure that link’s there for everybody watching and listening along. Check it out. Take advantage of folks who have put their time into the business and then are also giving back to show you, here’s exactly what I’m doing. So go follow along with Conner. Check out what he’s got going on. Again, thanks for being here today, For all those listening and watching, if you got value out of today’s episode, please like this episode. Share it with someone else you think can get value out of it. As always, please don’t forget to subscribe to our podcast.We appreciate every single one of you that follow along out there with us. We’ve got more conversations coming up with operators just like Conner out there building a real business in the industry. Thanks for joining us. We’ll see you all in the next episode.
