From Cold Calls to Financial Freedom | Real Estate Investing Tips

James R. Michener (00:00)
I

went and taught English in Taiwan and backpacked through Thailand and went to a farm in Montana. Anyways, long story short, came back, found a really good girl who I’m now married to and settled down and started selling real estate and had a coach back then and he said, you’re gonna have to start prospecting. And I’m like, what’s prospecting? He’s like, cold calling people. And I was like, there’s no way I wanna do that, right? I had already done that at Grand Canyon University that I worked for. So four months.

into it, he met with me and he’s like, so how many deals do you have? And I go zero. He’s like, you’re gonna have to start prospecting. So pulled up Zillow, Craigslist, started calling for sell by owners, started sending some appointments, things started rolling. And by the time I started doing that in June, I had my first closing at the end of June. So, and from then on that year, I closed 26 deals that year. The next year was

83 and so on and so forth but I Realized that we were doing so well that we had lived on such small income for such a long period of time That I really didn’t need all that so I started investing in real estate because that’s what my guardian father had done and he had retired at like 55 years old right which was way sooner than a lot of other people But he still had stuff to do right and he liked that he liked staying active and that seemed like a really good game plan for me So I got into that

And then I found out what wholesale was. And I’m like, man, I have all these deals, but it’s not necessarily something I want to do. I don’t want to list it because it’s going to go straight to an investor. And whenever I would list or I would find a good deal and I would give it to somebody, they’d say they had listed with me once they fixed it up. Well, a lot of times they would, they would list it with me, but the other 50 % of the time they were renting it out or they had a friend that was a real estate agent, or they just decided to keep it as their personal home. And I’m like, I’m getting cut out of too many deals. So.

I figured out what wholesale was and that was a game changer

Michelle Kesil (03:32)
Hey everyone, welcome to the Investor Fuel podcast. I’m your host, Michelle Kesil. Today I’m joined by someone I’ve been looking forward to chatting with, James Michener, hopefully I pronounced your last name correct. Okay, good, awesome. Who’s been making serious moves in the real estate and the investing space. So really excited to have you here on the show today. I think the listeners are really going to take something away.

James R. Michener (03:46)
Good job. Yeah, you did.

Michelle Kesil (04:01)
from how you’re approaching managing your real estate team and your own rental portfolio. So let’s dive into all of that.

James R. Michener (04:11)
Thank you, Michelle. I appreciate it. I’m looking forward to it.

Michelle Kesil (04:15)
Awesome. So first off, for people who are not familiar with you and your world yet, can you just give the short version of what your main focus is?

James R. Michener (04:27)
Yeah, in a nutshell, it’s real estate, but it’s the real estate team and then acquisition. So holding property and renting and then ⁓ fix and flips and wholesale as well as a little bit of private money lending as well.

Michelle Kesil (04:43)
And what markets do you operate in?

James R. Michener (04:46)
So we’re out of the Evpie County, which is northern Arizona. So Prescott, Arizona, primarily. Prescott, Prescott Valley, Dewey, which is about an hour and a half north of Phoenix.

Michelle Kesil (04:58)
Awesome. So how did you get started on your acquisition journey?

James R. Michener (05:51)
Yeah, so my guardian father was a broker. He’s been a broker for 43 years. And I remember when I was my senior year, I’d written a paper on what I wanted to be when I grew up. And apparently it was a real estate agent. didn’t even remember writing that paper. And so my guardian parents have pulled it out and they’re like, hey, this is the paper you wrote. You wanted to be a real estate agent. I’m like, that’s crazy. So I stayed there a little bit longer at the house and was talking with my guardian father. And I said, what made you want to get into real estate? And ⁓ he said, well, ⁓

I wanted to be able to control my time. wanted to be able to invest in the number one vehicle for becoming a millionaire and wealthy in the United States and in the world is through real estate. So I decided to do that. Plus I liked sales, so I wanted to make a lot of money with whatever I was going to be selling. So, um, so I jumped into it. I was in a master’s program at that time and said, drop out of that and give him a real estate license. After I did that, I did real estate for a couple of months and then

I

went and taught English in Taiwan and backpacked through Thailand and went to a farm in Montana. Anyways, long story short, came back, found a really good girl who I’m now married to and settled down and started selling real estate and had a coach back then and he said, you’re gonna have to start prospecting. And I’m like, what’s prospecting? He’s like, cold calling people. And I was like, there’s no way I wanna do that, right? I had already done that at Grand Canyon University that I worked for. So four months.

into it, he met with me and he’s like, so how many deals do you have? And I go zero. He’s like, you’re gonna have to start prospecting. So pulled up Zillow, Craigslist, started calling for sell by owners, started sending some appointments, things started rolling. And by the time I started doing that in June, I had my first closing at the end of June. So, and from then on that year, I closed 26 deals that year. The next year was

83 and so on and so forth but I Realized that we were doing so well that we had lived on such small income for such a long period of time That I really didn’t need all that so I started investing in real estate because that’s what my guardian father had done and he had retired at like 55 years old right which was way sooner than a lot of other people But he still had stuff to do right and he liked that he liked staying active and that seemed like a really good game plan for me So I got into that

And then I found out what wholesale was. And I’m like, man, I have all these deals, but it’s not necessarily something I want to do. I don’t want to list it because it’s going to go straight to an investor. And whenever I would list or I would find a good deal and I would give it to somebody, they’d say they had listed with me once they fixed it up. Well, a lot of times they would, they would list it with me, but the other 50 % of the time they were renting it out or they had a friend that was a real estate agent, or they just decided to keep it as their personal home. And I’m like, I’m getting cut out of too many deals. So.

I figured out what wholesale was and that was a game changer

for me, right? ⁓ Private lending became a pretty big thing for me because when we were at the peak, I got a little nervous with like doing my own investing and whatnot. So I paid off half of my rental portfolio and then saved another chunk of money and I wanted to try out private lending. And I really enjoyed that for a period of time until it got a little bit hairy and I was getting into some deals that maybe I didn’t feel 100 % comfortable with.

So at this point I pulled back on a lot of the private lending and have used that money to purchase my own deals because they’re coming through now. So now I have 35 rental properties. We have a consistent income of about 300,000 that comes in annually through just residual passive income. So that was kind of a goal. A goal for me was 100,000, right? And then it just…

kept creeping up, creeping up and became easier and easier. ⁓ the older I got, more experience I got, ⁓ the more I wanted to do. So.

Michelle Kesil (10:28)
Amazing. That’s such a powerful story. Yeah, you have so many skills and so many moving parts and yeah, just different side pieces of your business. So what has like been the key to keeping all of those moving parts running smoothly?

James R. Michener (10:38)
Yeah.

It’s been consistency, right? So I tell all my coaching students, they’re like, well, what do I need to do? It’s like the first thing you need to do is time block your schedule. Like if you can ask anybody, especially for the first like six years of my career, I always made sure that I did my prospecting in the morning, set those appointments. And like I would do it for about two to three hours a day. And I would just sit myself in my office, either in my home office or my office at our branch.

and would just sit there and call. And I would just stay consistent with that action. I always made sure I treated everybody really well, never been sued. So keeping the ethics in it as well was huge for me. And then always keeping my eye on the prize, right? What did I need to do in order to get to this, right? So I’d break it down. I needed to prospect for two to three hours. I needed to get in communication with at least 30 new people a day. And I needed to set one new appointment a day. And that would get me to X amount of closings a year.

which would make me X amount, which I could save X amount and then be able to invest X amount. So the longer I stayed in real estate, the more I saw these deals coming up and the more I saw the deals coming up, the more comfortable I got with taking on some of those. Also just the conversations I was having while prospecting and a lot of the people that were doing well financially were able to retire were more comfortable and had more options were the ones that I’d bought real estate.

held it and used it as a long-term play. So that was my goal from then on, right? And then we got to a point where we were so busy that we started adding admin and team members. And that was a big game changer for me because real estate can be really boring and really lonely at times because you’re doing it all on your own. So one of the key factors for me is keeping a team together and having other people help me because there’s only so much I can do.

Michelle Kesil (12:42)
Yeah, absolutely. We definitely are not meant to put all that work on ourselves, so that’s important.

James R. Michener (12:47)
No, not at all. Yeah. And then mentors

along the right way, right? Like that was so huge for me. My guardian father, masterminds, I went to conferences, I went to some of the coaches I had. YouTube was immensely helpful to me, you know? And then I know like from a business standpoint, maybe not a lot of people talk about this, but having a really good relationship with my wife and my family and my friends was huge because it kept my mental status really like strong.

So just having somebody that’s gonna support you throughout all of it is huge as well. Everybody always asks me, what’s the number one thing that’s most important, right, in your business and your life? For me, it’s who you marry, because they’re gonna either support you or take you down, right, in one way or another. I know that sounds drastic, but it’s pretty true. I’ve had some friends that have married crazy and their lives have turned out crazy, yeah. guys and gals, so.

Michelle Kesil (13:33)
Absolutely.

It’s important. mean, yeah, it’s who you’re

spending the most of your time and energy and shared beliefs with. So there’s definitely a lot of truth to that. Love that. So let me ask you this. Every operator I know has moments in their business where things get more real, maybe a deal goes sideways or you have to make a fast pivot.

James R. Michener (13:50)
Absolutely. Yep.

Michelle Kesil (14:08)
Would you mind sharing one of those moments that you’ve experienced in your business?

James R. Michener (14:13)
Yeah, I think the first one that I experienced is I bought a fix and flip near downtown Prescott and I put about $10,000 into it and I was telling myself I was going to make about 40 grand on it, right? So I put it on the market, I get a full price offer and then all of a sudden an appraisal comes in bad and I’m like, no way, this is crazy. I ended up making $4,000 on that and I’m like, okay, I have to look at these comps way differently. Like I haven’t lost anything, but I’m…

I need to readjust and look at this. And then there was a couple of private money deals that I did and the borrower kept asking for extensions. And as the extensions were getting asked for, I noticed that the market was changing. And finally I was just like, Nope, I’m not going to do it anymore. Like we need to cut this. And I’m glad I did it when I did it. So I haven’t lost any money yet on anything, which I’m thankful for, but I’ve also been very conservative.

And so it’s helped me and it’s hurt me, right? So some of my other friends that haven’t been as conservative had made big, big swings, but they’ve also lost like $800,000. know, one of my friends that are partners, they lost $800,000 during the downturn in 23. I’m like, I just did not want that. So other than that, it’s just having bad tenants, right? Like that can hurt you out, hurt you quite a bit as well. But.

A big thing for me is not wanting to be greedy and always asking a ton of questions. And I don’t care if I’m annoying or taking too long, if the deal doesn’t fall in line and it doesn’t work out and somebody else gets it before me, like that’s just how my world was supposed to work. And that’s God’s protection in my mind.

Michelle Kesil (16:39)
Yeah, absolutely. ⁓ So let me ask you this, what are you most focused on solving or scaling next?

James R. Michener (16:39)
Yep.

What I’m most focused on solving right now is kind of like my own head issues, right? Like when you go through a period of like super success like that, you can lose a lot of yourself, like your focus within your own life, like who you are, what you are, like what did you like, what didn’t you like? And so that can like drain you mentally, right? It’s not always just about the business, but it’s about keeping your mind healthy as well. So I went through a couple of years of struggle with that.

you know, there’s some big emotional ups and downs with it and then just some unfulfillment as well. So, and it was primarily driven by just not having enough time, having too much stress, not really focusing on like my physical health and my mental health at same time. So really getting that under control. And then what am I wanting to scale?

I always want to scale being able to contact more people, right? So getting a good CRM in place with a good cold caller, and it’s just been, that’s been the most difficult thing for me is like, if I’m not doing the lead prospecting and whatnot, getting others to do that and finding that right person has been very, very difficult. And even when I had the right person, something would come up so they would leave. So you’d get them for a year or six months and then they’d be gone.

then you have to find the next person. really scaling out would be the real estate team in terms of converting the leads that we have. I feel like we have the fix and flips pretty good because we have a lot of good people. ⁓ The rentals are good because we have a lot of our own handyman and I manage all those properties myself as well. So I have good tenants as of right now and I have really good handymen also. So that’s pretty much scaled out. And then I use an ⁓

online system where people pay rent, ask for repairs and such through there, and then my virtual assistant handles a lot of that for me.

Michelle Kesil (18:46)
Awesome. Yeah, I think that all of those things really can help shape the trajectory of your business. So, so important. What is the next big goal that you have can be for yourself or your business?

James R. Michener (18:54)
Absolutely. Yep.

Hmm the next big goal

The next big goal would be to…

I’ve been thinking about that. That’s part of the reason that like I want to feel more inspired, right? Because I want I know there’s something bigger and better out there but with where I’m at with my kids and whatnot and my family and where I’m at mentally I just don’t feel that yet. So the goal is probably just to contribute and give back at this point for now. Yep, in terms of like a monetary goal, I’m fairly happy with where I’m at right now. So nothing’s pushing me in that way but giving back and helping other people and

like contributing is probably the next big thing. So like there’ll be a panel mastermind and I’m gonna be on that panel asking questions like what you’re doing right now to the panelists. And I’m really excited about that, giving back to the community and of our agents here in our town. So I guess the next big goal would be to build up the coaching and to help more agents and other investors get to a point of financial freedom.

think that is the most important thing that anybody can do. And you have no other better vehicle than the business that you’re running right now. If it’s in real estate, whether it’s sales, it’s flipping, it’s wholesale, it’s whatever, like you have the biggest advantage that anybody could have, in my opinion.

Michelle Kesil (20:33)
Yeah, I love what you just touched on there with being really content with where you are right now and just giving back. yeah, I mean, I feel like once we’re in service and we’re kind of flipping the goal from me to others, then inspiration can land because you’re not focusing so much on what you need.

James R. Michener (20:52)
Yes. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, 100%. And for so long, it was about me, me, me instead of other people, right? And so now it’s about my family, my kids, and like the other people around me that could use help getting to where I’m at, especially right now with where the economy’s at, where the world’s at. Like, I just want the world to be a better place. And so like, for instance, we have a fix and flip that we’re doing. And this guy did an engineering cert and he didn’t do it correctly. But our main guy was like, well, it’s okay. Like we got the cert. I’m like, no, it’s not.

Because when somebody else goes to sell that property, they’re going to have to come out with $2,500 to $3,500 and redo it. And what if one of their family members is sick and they have to sell the house and then they need a procedure or a treatment and they can’t afford it because they got to pay for this? Like we’re going to do everything right. And if that means that our job slows down or it costs us a little bit extra money, whatever, we’re going to do it. We’re just going to make it right. So, and I want God to bless our, our deals. want to be blessed by God. I want to be blessed by the universe. Like

I just want to put good vibes out there, you know.

Michelle Kesil (22:02)
Yeah, I love that. That’s so powerful and important. You mentioned your coaching mentorship program. So can you expand a little bit more on what that entails?

James R. Michener (22:06)
Yeah.

Yeah,

so as of right now, what it is is I do four 45 minute sessions with each person. The first month is 1500 and then after that it’s 250 for a 45 minute call after that. So $250, but it’s on a need basis, right? So if you need the call, because what I figured out in my coaching is I don’t necessarily need a call every single week. Every two weeks would be great.

And like sometimes it’s every month would be great. Or sometimes it’s once a week because I got a lot going on and I need the advice, right? So I used to do things a lot cheaper. used to do it for free, but nobody took advantage. Like people just didn’t take advantage of it and they didn’t apply what I was doing. So one of my mentors, like you got to charge more and you should be like, you should be charging a thousand, 2000. But I’m like, that’s so much like I want to make it reasonable, right? But if people aren’t paying for it, then they’re not.

gonna take it serious.

Michelle Kesil (23:11)
True. It’s like a psychology thing that once you put like skin in the game, you’re actually going to like your brain absorbs the information versus if you have nothing in it, your brain kind of like doesn’t even want to take it in.

James R. Michener (23:12)
Yeah, for sure.

Yeah.

Sounds up.

Nope. Yep. I agree.

Michelle Kesil (23:29)
What are some of the conversations that you have with those mentees?

James R. Michener (23:34)
The biggest thing is really like how to get focused, right? Like what is the number one thing that they can do fine or foundationally to get them set up because they can do everything that they’re doing right now, right? But there’s just little tweaks that they have to make, right? Getting the right schedule, get calling the right leads and then really changing your mindset to like once I convert this listing, I sell it. Like I just had a coaching student call me on Monday and he said, James, like since we started coaching.

I got this off market deal. This guy’s selling for duplexes and I’m to make X amount of money. And what I’m thinking is I just buy one of those and I say, Hey, the commission that I make off these duplexes I’m selling for you. just put forward as a down payment on one of these so that I can keep one of those duplexes. then he owner owner finances it for me. Right? He’s like, before I had the conversation with you, I would have never ever thought about doing something like that. So it’s building your foundation.

And then changing your mindset to a get out of the rat race, get financially free, have passive income type of mindset. Cause once that changes, your whole view on the whole world changes on what actually makes sense. So yeah, I try not to be addicted to anything, but at this point I really, really, really like passive income because it’s just secure. I control it. I get to make the answer or I get to make the calls on it.

Michelle Kesil (24:48)
Yeah.

James R. Michener (25:02)
and it’s something that’s gonna come in every month that I can count on.

Michelle Kesil (25:07)
Yeah, I mean, that’s the goal I think for most people is to know that money is flowing in without you having to be like on your time. yeah, freedom.

James R. Michener (25:11)
Right?

Yeah.

Yep.

Absolutely. And what other investment are you going to buy where somebody else is going to pay it down for you in terms of a rental property? Right. And there’s a lot of my clients that are selling their houses right now and they’re older and they’re moving into a rental because they don’t, don’t want to deal with it. They don’t care that they’re not building equity or anything. They’re just older. They don’t want to deal with any of the, the like repairs or, or any of that stuff. They want to make call and make that happen. Sorry, Mike.

Michelle Kesil (25:45)
Yeah.

James R. Michener (25:47)
battery just got really dead really quick so sorry about that.

Michelle Kesil (25:49)
Oh no,

don’t worry. We’re going to wrap up here in a moment anyways. So yeah, just once you get that all plugged back in for people that want to connect with you, reach out to you and learn more from you. Do you wanna share the best place where people can find you?

James R. Michener (26:03)
Yep, here we go. ⁓

you

Yeah, generally it’s going to be Facebook or Instagram. ⁓ Sometimes it goes into like I had a coaching, a potential coaching student reach out to me on Instagram and it went into like requests so I didn’t see it for a while. ⁓ Or you could just reach out to me by text message at my phone number which is 928-308-4700. Again, text message is best because if you call me, I get so many sales calls all the time.

would be 928-308-4700 would be best. So Instagram, James Michener, or Facebook, James Michener. Yep.

Michelle Kesil (26:49)
Well, listen, I really

appreciate your time, your story, and your perspective. We need more people in this space doing things in this right way. So thank you for being here.

James R. Michener (27:00)
Yeah, you’re very welcome. Thank you, Michelle.

Michelle Kesil (27:03)
Yeah, and for the listeners tuning in, if you got value, make sure you’ve subscribed. We have more conversations coming soon with operators just like James who are building real businesses and we’ll see you all on the next episode.