Fraud Prevention in Real Estate: Insights from Title Expert Kevin Tacher

Erika (00:01.09)
Hey everyone, welcome to the Real Estate Pros podcast. I’m your host, Erika. And today we’re diving into the world of title insurance with someone who’s truly earned his crown in the industry, Kevin Thatcher, the founder and CEO of Independence Title, also known as Title King. He’s been shaking things up in title insurance, real estate closings, and fraud prevention. Kevin, I’m so thrilled to have you on the show.Kevin Tacher (00:30.251)
Thanks Erica, thanks for having me and I look forward to it.

Erika (00:34.84)
So let’s jump right in for our listeners who are not that familiar with what you do. Can you give us a quick rundown at Independence Title?

Kevin Tacher (00:44.799)
Yeah, absolutely. So I started Independence Title 22 years actually July 7th was 22 years in the business. Formerly I was a firefighter up in New York moved down 20 days before September 11th. Obviously, you know, we missed that tragic event and wanted to go up there so bad. We really thrive ourselves and I get goosebumps just talking about it about having the clients back, right? Going in the deal together, leaving the deal together, leaving no one behind. So I built a business based on

relationships and and credibility of being in this industry of you know not saying no to people and about truly looking at opportunities and partnering with the investors and the real estate agents and the mortgage lenders about knowing that we’re in this together right it’s a relationship and you’re not just a number you you are an actual relationship with us and 22 years later we’re closing deals anywhere in Florida as long as the property is in Florida but I get phone calls from people all over the country that love to talk to me and pick my brain about

you know, we do, how we do it, and most importantly, I love getting on the calls with my competitors even, talking to them about how we’ve built the company we built, because there’s enough business for everyone. If my clients were to leave me to go to my competition, the only thing that means is my competition is doing something better than I am. So I love sharing a wealth of information with people, and title insurance is not a fun topic, so we try and make it as fun as possible.

Erika (02:13.134)
That’s great. And I love that you’re so eager to share that information and help people. So what’s been the secret sauce to keeping all of those transactions that you’re running smooth and stress free?

Kevin Tacher (02:27.84)
I mean, communications number one, you know, if you’re working with a title company and they’re not communicating, I was actually just on a call just before this with an investor. It says he’s leaving his title company in North Florida because they just don’t communicate. They disappear, they don’t answer emails, they don’t answer the phone, they don’t communicate. My clients have my cell phone number. They can text me, call me anytime, preferably not in the middle of the night, but I start answering emails four or five in the morning and I love just helping.

helping people and it goes back to the firefighter days. Like we go in that deal together and we will leave that deal together and you know if you don’t get paid I don’t get paid. So at the end of the day we have a vested interest to make sure everybody wins and if it’s a deal we can’t do we’ll tell you like it just we can’t do it or it just doesn’t make sense to us or we just don’t think that’s a…

legitimate type deal. You know, we get all kinds of questions that people ask and I always tell people we’ll walk the line. We’ll never cross the line, but we know how to walk that line really well to make sure that we can get as creative as possible, right? We study all the blogs and we listen to all the webinars and we’ve taken all the courses to truly understand the investor world. And it starts with you coming to me knowing that we’re going to have your back and we’re going to get that deal across the finish line because at the end of the day, you need to get paid as the

investor.

Erika (03:54.264)
Yeah, yeah, that’s some good stuff. you’ve had some moments that it seems like your grit has really been tested. And I know that you’ve uncovered real estate fraud too. Can you share some of those moments?

Kevin Tacher (04:08.638)
Yeah, so I mean, we’ve been doing this now, like I said, 22 years. We’ve been part of FBI sting operations. We’ve uncovered fake sellers. We’ve put people in jail. So we’ve gone to court and we’ve been witnesses and we’ve turned people in. Our most famous was on…

NBC, it was a big sting operation where they had a bunch of different teams of people in here taking down an armed robber many years ago. That was, did 10 years, got out and started doing home stealing scams and we uncovered, he stole, I think it was five homes that we uncovered. they kind of did like catch a predator. We’ve seen the guy that goes and tries to catch these child predators. So very similar and they were waiting for him as soon as he walked out and as soon as he got in his car, they took him down.

We spent about 200 hours building a case against him and

You know, we didn’t want to. We tried to just send him on his way because we’re like, just go. Like, we don’t want to do these types of deals. But he kept coming back and coming back and coming back. And eventually, you know, we didn’t have a choice but to to turn him in. The second one, I’ll tell you, was a wire fraud case where a lady, her name was Patricia Verlino. This one got us on Fox News in New York City, was a victim of a wire fraud scam where she diverted her money to a fake seller. She worked three jobs. This was her first home she was buying. She was already living in.

in the seller’s condo because it was vacant. They let her move in early with her three children. And at the end of the day, she fell victim. We weren’t doing the closing, but we found it through a online forum. She came to us and I said, let me see what I can do to help her. We got her story on the local news here in South Florida. We got it on Fox News in New York City. We were able to recover half of her money. So it’s 60,000. We recovered about 30,000. I personally set up a GoFundMe for her and raised

Kevin Tacher (06:01.49)
the other 30,000 obviously with the help of Fox News and we took the closing from that title company successfully closed and then probably about nine months later she got a call that they recovered a certain portion of that 30,000 that we weren’t able to recover and then she was able to renovate her house and she still lives there today with her three children. So that was the second story that was pretty cool. The third one is most recent which was probably the one that we thought was going to put us out of business.

It’s the book we wrote called Intercepted, which you can find on Amazon. hit best seller today at 11 a.m. And this is a story of how we didn’t think we could be a victim of wire fraud because we teach on it, we coach on it, we win awards on it, we uncover it every single day. But unfortunately, a seller’s email got compromised. One of my employees fell for, former employees now fell for a wire fraud scam. And what we learned through that process is from my firefighting days, who has your

and who doesn’t? Nobody had our back. We had to fight with the FBI, the Secret Service, the banks, the insurance companies, the underwriters. Everyone wanted to throw their hands in the air and basically pretend it wasn’t their problem. So we made it our mission to document every step of the way what we did. And then since we’ve emailed it out to every title company licensed in the state of Florida and every title company, title agent in the state of Florida,

to learn what to do if you are compromised. So we took this big disaster.

turned it into a growth opportunity for the entire industry. At the end of the day, our efforts recovered 86.66 % of the seller’s money. Insurance covered the rest and we paid their legal fees out of our pocket. And it was a great story, right? Great story at the end of the day. Sellers made whole. We learned who has our back and who doesn’t. And now we’re teaching the entire industry what to do if you fall victim of wire fraud because nobody will have your back but yourself.

Erika (08:04.236)
Yeah, wow, those are some incredible stories there. And just the relationships that you’ve built and the lessons that you’ve learned from all of that and the victory afterwards that you overcome so many issues and help people out, wow. So that makes me want to ask you, what’s been the biggest game changer for you when it comes to growing your network and

building trust because clearly with your experience you’ve dealt with a lot of that.

Kevin Tacher (08:36.66)
Yeah, I mean, I would say the biggest game changer in my business, now this was many years ago, there’s a little red book called The Go Giver.

It’s by author Bob Berg, who is a very good friend of mine. He was a mentor of mine, lives just up the road in Jupiter, Florida. I met him for coffee one day, just fluke. A friend of mine said, can I meet him? And I said, you know what, this lady helped me out. And I said, let me see if I can get a meeting. And he said, sure, come on up to Dunkin’ Donuts, which is his choice of coffee. And we sat down and that…

Interview not interview, but that meeting changed my life. It turned out I gave him my last $5,000 on my credit card I invested in his coaching program and I eventually took that program not to make money for selling his program Which is what he really does that’s his business, but it was to understand how important relationships are in day-to-day business and That is what I teach on that is what I coach other agents on and clients and investors I speak to when I go to networking events that it’s

It’s not about handing out 100 business cards. It’s about handing out three and building.

genuine relationships with these people. So may God rest his soul, one of the largest wholesalers in South Florida passed away this year. One of my dear friends was a great client of mine for many, many, many years. A loyal client, right? It’s all about loyalty. And then his wife approached me and asked me, you know, I don’t trust anyone but you to help see if we can bundle up his, wholesaling list and sell it for, for the family. And I did it. And everyone in the industry was like, there’s no one better.

Kevin Tacher (10:12.828)
to do it than you because we know this gentleman trusted you and we trust you and we know it’s legitimate and there were people trying to fake sell his list like they had it and everyone knew like my credibility my ethics my morals and my relationship with people is the top priority so if there’s anyone listening here don’t be your typical shysty real estate agent

build genuine relationships with these sellers and if you’re wholesaling with other investors and lenders and you will be the go-to person that everyone’s gonna wanna do business with you, like this guy that passed away, people would know the investor that had the deal.

but they would go to him to cut him into the wholesale deal because they only wanted to deal with him. And that’s the same way in our business. Like people want to do business with us because they know us, they like us, and they trust us. And at the end of the day, when something goes wrong, that’s when you’re going to be thankful you had someone like that on your side.

Erika (11:11.842)
Yeah, those real relationships are so important and, you know, when when trouble comes knocking, you’ll you’ll know if those relationships are real or not.

Kevin Tacher (11:20.96)
Yeah, I I always tell people, know, title company, every title company issues the same thing. We issue a title policy. Hopefully our customer service is good. We’ve been in business 22 years and we have almost 300 Google reviews. So hopefully our credibility speaks for itself. But where the real power comes is when there’s a title claim or an issue or a fraud attack or a fake transaction that’s being approached and you need to navigate it. Or as an investor, there’s another investor trying to cut you out of the

and we need to have conversations on how everyone can win, that’s when you’re going to be thankful you had a title company like us, hopefully in Florida, but get that type of relationship anywhere in the country, because I know your program speaks to people all over the country. So, you know, get a title company on your side, not some national company, someone local that you can build a genuine win-win relationship with, and it’ll take your deals across the finish line every time.

Erika (12:23.342)
Awesome. So I also wanted to get into more of the specifics with title insurance. But when I say specifics, I want to be careful here because I would say title insurance can be kind of misunderstood. So maybe you can break that down and help real estate pros and home buyers understand that better and protect their investment.

Kevin Tacher (12:46.782)
Yeah, I’m glad we saved this for later in the interview because title insurance is probably one of the most boring topics you can…

talk about and you know if we would have started with this they probably would have hung up from from the interview from watching it so I’m glad we saved this for a little bit later on but you know we try and make it sexy obviously title insurance is here when you need it I always like to compare to other types of insurance that everyone has you drive a car you have car insurance you you go to the doctor health insurance you die you have life insurance

All of these insurances are protecting what we call future risk, right? You drive a car.

Will you get into an accident? Life insurance, will you die? Health insurance, will you get sick? Title insurance protects in reverse. That’s the easiest way to explain it to people. So we look at the public records and all of these items that may affect the rights of that buyer to own that property, the land, not the house itself. We don’t care about the house. We care about the land, the right to use the four corners of the property. And that’s what we’re insuring. So we do a title search and a municipal search, which is like county for

permits, code enforcement, utility bills, and we’re checking for things like open mortgages, liens, judgments, bankruptcies, HOA issues, things that IRS liens, divorce child support liens, things that would cause the buyer to…

Kevin Tacher (14:13.822)
jeopardize their ownership. So someone comes back, maybe an heir to an estate, so a person dies and you know, there’s a uncle Sam that’s floating out there that says, nope, I have a right to that property and they challenge it. So that’s where title insurance really important. A current real scenario, as crazy as it sounds, we have an investor that owned a property, got a deed from someone, bought her a property, turned out at the end of the day,

She’s actually a exotic dancer and one of her clients bought the property for her. So we actually have a hearing this week on Thursday to go to court to testify. But you know, that’s where title insurance kicks in because whether her ownership right was legal, unjust, she tricked him, whatever the case may be, you want to make sure you have title insurance. So she’s happy she has title insurance to protect her because originally this seller is saying,

No, I didn’t give her that property. Like, I don’t know who she is.

And then of a sudden she admitted text messages into the court record to show, no, you knew who I was. was an exotic dancer. You met me at the club. You fell in love with me and you bought me this property. So as crazy as the story sounds, that’s when title insurance is now going to kick in. And I’m going to be a witness in defense of a title insurance policy for a closing that was done. So we see these all the time. Could be heirs. It really comes down to someone challenging the right to you to freely own that property and title insurance

will.

Kevin Tacher (15:47.691)
Hopefully, which is why you only pay for it once, it’s interesting, will hopefully cover you because as you heard with our wire fraud scam, we thought that would have covered the seller for the scam and it didn’t. So it doesn’t always cover everything that comes up, which is why it’s most important to work with a title company that has your back. Like one where I said to the seller’s attorney, I have your back, I will do everything I can to make sure you are paid. If it means I have to pay you a dollar a day for 250,000,

days, I will get you your money. Like I will find a way to get your money. again, relationships are important, but title insurance is needed and you only pay for it one time when you buy the home. So it’s important, why not buy it? It’s a small cost, unlike other types of insurance, which are monthly, annually, biannually, and it’s a much added expense.

Pay for it once, set it, forget it, and hopefully it covers you. If not, go back to the title company and see what they can do to help you.

Erika (16:50.018)
That was a very helpful breakdown. Thank you so much for that.

Kevin Tacher (16:53.652)
You’re welcome.

Erika (16:55.288)
So I would like to talk about what’s next. You’ve got a solid rock operation with independence title. You have this new book out that’s a best seller. What’s the next big goal that you’re zeroing in on?

Kevin Tacher (17:11.358)
Yes, I mean, you know, we talked originally about setting up for this.

interview about weaknesses, right? What are weaknesses? And I don’t believe we have weaknesses. Any good entrepreneur doesn’t have a weakness. They turn weakness into opportunity. probably, the crash of 2006, 7, 8-ish time where things were really bad for us, we’ve turned every chaotic situation into an opportunity. So we’re continuing to grow the title company. We’re continuing to build relationships. We’re continuing to do interviews and work with

people. But the newest thing on the horizon is coaching, coaching other title companies that have fell victim of wire fraud. Because what we found is when I fell victim, they said,

will get involved, but you pay us 10 % of how much we recover. Well, if you recover $800,000, you’ve got to pay me $80,000, and that’s not covered by insurance. So you got to come out of pocket. So I learned that there’s just so many companies ripping people off. I wanted to turn our tragedy into an opportunity for others. So for a nominal fee, they can call me. I will work with them for 90 days. I will give them my contacts at the Secret Service, the FBI, who to contact, what to do, how to review their insurance.

what’s covered, not covered, help you build your insurance claim, help you reach out to your underwriters, help you talk to the clients involved for a very, very nominal fee just because I feel like they gotta pay something, but I’ve learned so much. Or they can just buy the book for $15 and download the report that shows them what to do, but most won’t know what to do. So that’s kind of the next thing on the horizon is really trying to change our industry. And my next step in the battle is to

Kevin Tacher (18:58.562)
to go to Congress and figure out a way where we can change how the banks process wire transfers. Because what we learned in this process that as long as the account number matches, they’ll credit the account. So in our case, we sent money to a fake account.

It was in the name of the seller. So Mr. Mrs. Smith at the fraudsters account number, which was in the name of their own business. It wasn’t like they set up a fake account in the seller’s name. And somehow that gets credited, which doesn’t make sense to me. There should be some type of double check process. So we’re going to work on going to Congress with that now that we’ve gotten through the recovery and stress of recovering the money and we launched the book. And I’m going to take it all the way up the food chain to really see if we can change the way

electronic transfers and bank responsibilities are. And that’s going to be nationally. I’m going to take that national and see what we can do. So, title company is fun and I enjoy it. I love it and it continues thriving. But I think this is my next chapter is figuring out how we can change the industry a little bit.

Erika (20:06.958)
That’s really exciting, Kevin. And that really says about your character that that’s how you want to spend your time. That’s a very selfless thing to do.

Kevin Tacher (20:16.938)
Thank you.

Erika (20:18.254)
So before we wrap up, if someone wants to connect with you, learn more about Independence Title, or work with the title king himself, what’s the best way to reach out?

Kevin Tacher (20:30.674)
Yeah, websites, titlerate.com. So T-I-T-L-E-R-A-T-E.com, titlerate.com. You can Google us. We’re in Fault Lauderdale, Florida, Independence Title. You can find one of my books on Amazon. You can check me out on Facebook or LinkedIn or Instagram. Basically, just put my name in Google. You’ll find me. Connect with me. And I’d love to have a conversation about…

Challenges you’re having and how can we turn those challenges into growth opportunities whether it’s a business challenge I run a coaching program for real estate agents and real estate investors Helping them understand more not how to acquire a deal Which is what all these boot camps teach you or classes or how to find a listing but how to teach you how to build a business Like how do you build a sustainable business?

that will have an endless stream of business coming in instead of constantly hunting. So we teach you how to build a farming business, how to teach you on branding and follow up and things like that. So I love talking to people about business or if you have a tricky title deal that as well. Bring my way as tricky, the trickier the better and we’ll love to get it across the finish line for you and get you paid.

Erika (21:43.82)
Awesome, Kevin. Thank you so much for dropping all of this wisdom today. Your passion for real estate and commitment for doing things the right way, even wanting to change the industry, is really inspiring. For everyone listening, make sure you’re subscribed so you can hear from more experts. Until next time, keep building your real estate empire, everyone, and we’ll see you on the next episode. Bye.

Kevin Tacher (22:09.034)
Bye bye everyone, thank you.

Erika (22:12.104)
All right, I hope you had fun doing that. I sure did.

Kevin Tacher (22:14.547)
Absolutely, yeah.