How Infinite Banking and Real Estate Syndications Build Generational Wealth

Madhavi Jain (00:00)
I think falling for shiny numbers, you know, there’s like syndication we’re not known known, you know, just a couple of years ago, two, three years ago, it was not so popular, right? There is a lot of CrowdStreet platforms and people have started knowing about it. And you know, from five thousand minimum to fifty thousand minimum, there’s like a different variety of it, right? And I come from a consulting background, right? I mean, presentations and numbers and projecting.

Really I’ve what I would call like a shiny shiny numbers. I think that is one of the biggest risks that they don’t see it. They look at the presentations, the presentations are well-made with AI, it’s getting even better when it comes to the visual display of what the presentation should be.

Scott Bursey (02:15)
Welcome back to the *Real Estate Pros* podcast, powered by Investor Fuel. I’m your host, Scott Bursey. And today we’re joined by Madhavi Jain, the powerhouse behind Think Outside the Stocks. Madhavi is changing the game for investors by leveraging a two-fold approach that combines the financial efficiency of infinite banking with the high-yield risk-managed world of passive commercial real estate syndications with an active portfolio of.

790 multifamily units valued at over 170 million dollars. She’s built a reputation for navigating complex market landscapes through strategic partnerships. Madhavi, welcome to the show.

Madhavi Jain (02:57)
Thank you so much, Scott. It’s so nice to be here on your show and thank you so much for the invite.

Scott Bursey (03:04)
It is awesome having you here, Madhavi and to help our pros get up to speed. Please give us the front row seat and how your career ignited and where you’re pouring your fuel now.

Madhavi Jain (03:13)
Absolutely. Thank you so much for asking, Scott. So, Scott, I’m, you know, what I like to say is that I have an uncommonly common story. And the reason I say that, you know, every bit of my story is gonna resonate with you know, you probably or your listeners or you know, somebody out there. so that uncommonly common story, I have I came to this country with my husband with two suitcases and a couple of hundred converted dollars, right? And we started our life from scratch. We built from scratch, and you know, both of us.

We’re working for one of the top five consulting. We had our first kid here, you know, the car, the house, the whole nine yards, right? The American dream. So we were living an American dream. That’s what we thought. And then 2008 happened, Scott. So very interestingly, 2008. different people remember it different ways. and we remember it in it’s a very challenging situation, right? That we both of us, by the way.

We’ve worked at the same company, same projects for 13 years together. So we saw each other 24 7. it had its pros, and the biggest con we realized it’s 2008, is that both of us were called to the office and said that, hey, next week, next Friday, is going to be the last day on this project. And in technical terms, like the the consulting for terms, that that means you have two weeks to find a new project or you’re just out of your job. And now imagine we have this white elephant of our house in California.

We have a daughter. We have built this life here with you know, the family is not around, so with the friends and you know, kind of putting our roots there. we are on H-1 visa still, and it’s not, I mean, immigration is a big thing. And we just got to know that we would not have this project in in next a week or so, right? And the worst thing was that about to I was about to give birth to our second child, right? So that was like a punch in a gut, right?

So when we recovered from that.

We moved to Austin, you know, found another job, blah, blah, blah. Everything great. had the resilience to kind of face that, and we started our life again in here in Austin, moving from away from California. and we rebuilt our life here again, right? And again continued working from the top five consulting. I’ve worked for the company 15 years or so. and 2015, you know, I came across a kind of

A situation in my life, the personal health was declining. Very young, but you know, some chronic conditions that’s deteriorating me. I had to pull the plug. So that six-figure running, corporate job, top five consulting, and I had to pull the plug. I had to stop working. So, you know, in this field, when people actually come in, they create the partial income, get to that complete financial freedom, and then they drop their law jobs, right? so that they can start in this alternate world.

But for me, I had that cliff that I just had to like leave the job and then start building, right? And then everybody has their own whys, right? My biggest why was my daughter. My daughter was a middle schooler at the time. So I kept looking at her and it’s like, my God, she’s gonna be high schooler soon. And in college, and it’s like I did not want her to choose based on what we can afford. I wanted to choose her to choose based on what her caliber was, where wherever in state outs out of state she wanted to go, right?

And as an Indian family, the education is of prime importance. so that’s why I kept on looking at alternates, right? And then real estate, of course, you know, came through because you know, 90% of millionaires are made through mil made through the real estate. So that’s when I really started you know looking at real estate. And I wanted, again, with my health condition, what something which was passive, something does not need my attention. And at this point, my husband is pretty busy with his consulting career too, right?

And that’s when I started looking at passive income and this plethora of options, right? About BRRRR, the tax liens, and you know, wholesaler or buy for cash and fix and flip, all of those things I started looking at and it was very, very you know, time consuming and effort consuming as well, right? So I thought that hey, IRS says that being a landlord is passive. So let’s be a bland lord. So started creating the portfolio, a small short-term rental quite accidentally.

But when I started building it and everything goes well in the the rental real estate till it doesn’t, right? So that happened with us. And we had that one tenant. it was straight out of episode of *Hoarders*. And I cannot begin to tell you what that experience was, but we again, you know, survived from that at this point. And we rebuild it that house, spent about 25k just to bring it back to its glory, which was giving us $350 per month cash flow.

So that was kind of a setback, but you know, every time there is a setback, whether coming to this country, whether the health, whether the 2008, we have just shown resilience over and over again. And I do have a motto from that that, you know, when life gives you lemon, why stop at making just lemonade? make a margarita out of it. So this is my margarita. And I just don’t want my margarita. you know, I have created it and I’m serving it too. Think Outside the Stocks.

So that’s when I started looking into syndications and first as a passive investor and I also came across infinite banking around that time, and very interestingly, one thing I was super skeptical about, and one thing I was very, very excited about, right? And you can guess which one is that. So of course the infinite banking was super skeptical that was like, nothing good can come out of that. I don’t want to do that. But when I come across that, right, I’m a very numbers person.

So I was like, okay, let me go back to my spreadsheets. when I’m excited, too excited, or when I’m very conservative or kind of skeptical, go back to your numbers, numbers don’t lie, created multiple scenarios, multiple spreadsheets, and modeled out. this is before the ChatGPT world, right? so modeled out personally all those things. And I realized, my God, infinite banking by itself, it works really well. The syndication itself will work very well.

If you put together, that’s kind of an exponential, right? So that’s the biggest advantage that we have as an and asset. And I was mind blown. And I was mind blown. I was very excited that hey, I found this for my family’s financial structure. Now I can implement it. I am it made me happy, Scott, but it made me restless. It made me restless because the community around me that I came from, the first generation immigrant, the tech world, the medical world, they have no time.

Get to know about this. It’s like a parallel universe that they’re living in. And I just thought that, you know, I have to bring to them. And that’s why the Think Outside the Stocks was born. And I’m on a mission to change trajectory of one family at a time and thousands more to go. And that’s what you know my Margarita and what I’m serving here as well. So I hope that gives you a little bit background about the Think Outside the Stocks and me.

Scott Bursey (11:51)
It most certainly does, Madhavi, and let me say that is a roller coaster of a journey. What really caught my attention about you was the way that you’ve been able to seamlessly integrate the concept of infinite banking with large scale syndications to create a truly bulletproof wealth-building system. That is just not easy.

Madhavi Jain (11:59)
Yeah.

Absolutely, Scott. And you know, spot on, I think you know, my unique advantage is is kind of you know able to simplify, right? Because you know, when people don’t hear about these things, right? when you throw information at them, education at them, it’s it’s a a a whole confusing kind of a kind of a mesh, right? so my unique advantage is that not only I understand this world, right? So when I go to my

Infinite banking world and I talk about real estate, they have absolutely no idea about it. And I go to my real estate world and conferences and my peers of fund managers. I’m also fund manager, right? And I talk about infinite banking. Maybe like two to three percent people have heard about it and implemented it so that they don’t have any idea about it, right? So that kind of places me not only in a position to kind of eagle-side perspective, look at these two things and understand them well.

Educate on them and also help them implement right and my biggest motto quite honestly Scott and I know we in this business have this value system that it’s not about selling what products we have or what strategies that we have it’s about what’s right fit right so when I talk to my investors for first first time in a meeting they’re very eager about what’s the investment opportunity what’s the returns and what can I look at and I’m like no hold on hold on that’s just thinking like a frog in a pond let’s step back like an eagle

And think about how you can grow, preserve, protect, and pass your generation wealth. So when you’re integrating those two strategies together, and one is you know the guaranteed growth bulletproof, which is the infinite banking, as you mentioned, and then there is a risk managed, right? Any investment comes with the risk, right? It’s not nothing is risk-free. If somebody tells you this is a risk-free investment, run. So you know just managing them together, it is what creates and what I have created as a Wealth in a Vault.

Strategy and that’s how we help the investors.

Scott Bursey (14:16)
I’d be curious to know what do you see as the biggest strength in maintaining such a large multifamily portfolio while managing investor relations?

Madhavi Jain (15:06)
Yeah, actually, you know, again going back to the portfolio, right? So I’m a fund manager. So want to just speak clear about that. As a fund manager, I bring the operators and I, you know, the partnerships, bringing really high class, best-in-class operators to the to the table is one of my kind of a hidden advantage, right? I’m very, very passionate about due diligence and running the due diligence on the sponsor team, on the underwriting, on the legal, the debt, and that’s what I have created like a trust.

But verify kind of a framework. So I want to be clear about that. You know, when we bring these investments in the portfolio that you talk about, these are the original investments that the sponsors have. They have done their due diligence, but we bring those due diligence weighted investments into our fund. And yes, and that’s the biggest challenge is the investor relationship because there is, you know, a place where this all nitty-gritty details of underwriting and the cap rates and you know.

The whole terminologies of syndicated worlds exist. And at the same time, here people who are really working hard, their hard-earned money, whether it’s sitting in into their you know, retirement accounts, whether they’re sitting into cash accounts, this is really their hard-earned money. So there is a huge gap in what their expertise is to evaluate this and what it’s needed, right? And that’s where that bridge comes in between: is that okay.

I’m able to evaluate. I’m able to simplify and explain it to them. And they are able to understand and ask those questions. And quite honestly, the investor education is the way to solve it, right? Because with the education, I put that one foot in front of the other slowly for them so that they can become better investors to ask better questions. I a better investor with an you know developing that expertise to ask those right questions, I think is the is the best investor you can have.

Scott Bursey (17:05)
Madhavi, thank you for breaking that down. And fascinated by the idea of risk management. What is the biggest weakness you see investors commonly making in passive syndications today?

Madhavi Jain (17:18)
Wow, I think falling for shiny numbers, you know, there’s like syndication we’re not known known, you know, just a couple of years ago, two, three years ago, it was not so popular, right? There is a lot of CrowdStreet platforms and people have started knowing about it. And you know, from five thousand minimum to fifty thousand minimum, there’s like a different variety of it, right? And I come from a consulting background, right? I mean, presentations and numbers and projecting.

Really I’ve what I would call like a shiny shiny numbers. I think that is one of the biggest risks that they don’t see it. They look at the presentations, the presentations are well-made with AI, it’s getting even better when it comes to the visual display of what the presentation should be.

And the shiny numbers, right? You know, considering that hey, this investment is 15% IRR and this is giving me 20% IRR. Not understanding the logistics behind it.

And something like an underwriting, right? What are underwriting assumptions are? And you know, first year, for example, if somebody is projecting you know, five percent growth in the rents versus projecting conservatively zero to one percent growth, that can completely change that IRR equation, right? So that is the number one thing that I see that the investors have challenges, and the second aspect that I see again and again, and this happens mostly with the first-time investors when they’re not

Kind of know savvy about this world is that they want to put the money in the city that live. And quite honestly, you know, I have been there. I have been that LP that I wanted to do my first investment in Austin because I could I could see it. I if whenever I want, I can go check it out. And I thought that’s my due diligence and kind of a watching over. but trust me, that is the one investment that has not paid me even a penny. So I made that mistake. And that’s what I I see people

Making that mistake, asking for it that, hey, do you have anything in Austin market or do you have any anything in the Florida or Orlando market? Because that’s what I where I live. And I would really go and see and keep an a tab on that investment. But that’s not the right way to look at it. you have to look at the growth path. You have to look at you know the emergent cities, right? Sometimes all these prime cities are already, you know, so developed and so

Ahead of the curve that you might want to find the secondary markets, and that’s where the opportunities are. So that’s what I would say that you know, falling for shiny numbers and the way to solve it. I don’t just like to put the question, but I like to put the answer as well. So the way to solve is the due diligence. Due diligence, due diligence, due diligence. And you know, that’s why I have created a transport framework and my multifamily due diligence framework is about 230 points.

And that’s what we use to do our utilities and bring fitted investment in our file. So that’s how you solve the first part. And the second part is, you know, not be fascinated by city around you because it’s probably already at its peak. And just look into the growth part. Look at the statistical parameters. I’m a math major. I come from a statistical background too, right? So look at the statistical drivers, why you want that market or especially that submarket, where that property is and how it’s going to perform.

So hopefully that helps.

Scott Bursey (20:36)
I love that framing and digging deeper into your niche. What is an untapped opportunity in the commercial multifamily space that you’re currently pouring your fuel into?

Madhavi Jain (20:49)
So right now, I think for commercial real estate, especially multifamily in apartment complex, people who don’t know the multifamily, we tend to use a multifamily word a lot. I’ve realized it. but I think Scott, it’s very interesting that you asked this question. because we are at a at a juncture where we are in an opportunity, which is a once-in-a-decade opportunity. And I was talking to you about some time back, and it is truly, truly.

Once in a decade or once in a lifetime, kind of an opportunity too. So what happened in 2008 for a single family? That’s what is happening for multifamily, right? So, you know, a couple of years ago when the Fed had this, nobody saw this coming, the rate hikes, and that was detrimental. You know, the operators when they were underwriting and they were purchasing those multifamily apartments, they did not see this rampant of the rate hikes coming.

And because of that, what happened, right? To simplify it, right? I don’t want to make it very complex, but I want to simplify it, right? so you have a kind of a rate that’s variable, right? Interest rates that’s variable. You’re not locked into the fixed, and that’s mostly happened when they they went into that that variable rate, right? And when you are, you know, your interest rate first of all goes up because this rapid change happened, and there is something you know call a rate cap.

Which is an insurance against that kind of a hike, right? Which kind of likes you, locks you. It’s almost similar to that that you know, when you have the options, right? It’s kind of locks you. so that cost kind of went rampant, right? So the fundamentals, if you want to think about like in the stock terms, the fundamentals of the properties are really strong. What are the fundamentals of the property? The the value of the property, the sorry, the the infrastructure of the property.

The tenant best and the way they are paying, the way you can put in the value add, that is the fix and flip that you do inside apartment, and you can increase the the rent, right? So that is all happening. The fundamentals are right. But because of this equation, which is imbalanced, now they have to pour more money into giving to the lender, right? So, because of that, many, many properties are in trouble. They are in negative cash flow and they have been so.

For you know a couple of years now and it’s not sustainable anymore. So what is happening is, and I would say that three problems. And out of this problem, if you have first of all, first number one, the distribution stopped. That’s list of your problems. Capital call, I would say midway. Yes, capital call is bad, but you know, 15%, 20% capital call is still kind of okay. But you have to see that are you just throwing money at the kitchen sink? You have to make sure.

That you’re not pouring money, which is already rotting and which is already bad. So be very careful. And number three is capital loss. And I’m talking about massive capital loss. I’m talking about not just 15%, 20%, 50%. I’m talking about 100%. So when you know this list, operators have given the key back to the lenders, now they have wiped out the equity. These values of these properties have dropped dropped even beyond the loan value.

So even the lenders are in trouble because now they have to write this off, right? So that is what the challenge is. But again, I think we have to look at it from two perspectives, right? When there is so much blood in the market, right? There’s so much blood in the road, and mayhem is happening. That is just one side of the coin. It’s got the other side of the coin is what the opportunity and what the question you ask. So we are now actually looking at the values of this apartment complex falling so low.

That is not just the 30-40% discount, what we saw two, three years ago, but even more than that. So these property values have kind of some have reset in some markets to like five years, seven years back. So that is what the opportunity that has created. Like I I said some time back, what happened to the 2000 single family home in 2008? That’s what’s happening in the multifamily. So we are sitting on a tremendous opportunity. So I’m still kind of watching it.

And when I see that right property, that pencils in that underwritten well, that’s when I bring it with again the thorough due diligence from operator to to lender to you know the PPM and how the classes are structured.

Scott Bursey (25:23)
Madhavi, that is such powerful perspective right there. Thank you for highlighting that. And looking at the big picture, what strategy has been the most consistent for your growth over the last let’s say three, four years?

Madhavi Jain (25:39)
Yeah, I think, you know, let’s step back a little bit, right? I mean, when everything is this happening, I mean, there are some properties that even I have invested my personal money that they’re, you know, kind of capital call. We have, you know, we haven’t seen kind of a complete loss of multifamily yet, but you know, some capital call distribution stops. So there is challenges that’s going on. But in terms of opportunity, right? I mean, the biggest thing in this whole kind of wave of changes, whether it’s political, whether it’s

You know, the market pressure, whether it’s the interest rates, the inflation. One thing that has run really well and stable, and which I would go back to, you know, Warren Buffett saying that, you know, remember the two principles is that number one, never lose money. And number two, don’t forget the principle number one. So never lose money, never lose money, never lose money, right? And that’s what the infinite banking is. So my dry powder, that’s my opportunity that’s sitting in the

Infinite banking has not lost, no matter what it is, right? And that’s the biggest advantage of that system, that it has seen 150 years, 170 years. So Scott, I’m talking about like, you know, beyond our lifetime, because you know, it has seen Great Depression, it has seen civil wars, it has seen 2008, it has seen COVID, it has not budged, right? The the the system is with the institutions which are 150, 170 year old.

And this is where you can actually, instead of you putting your money into the bank, you create your own banking system, you move it over there, and it has consistently provided dividend year after year, even when the banks were like giving you know lower than 1% as an interest, right? And this is the safety net. So don’t get me wrong, it’s not an investing vehicle, this is the savings vehicle. And that’s where I see the biggest opportunity right now in people who are you know out of fear, just parking their money.

Know creating this system, pushing it in here so that it kind of grows consistently. And then the next three, four years, like I said, that you know, watching the commercial real estate very closely. And every cycle, right? You just have to know where to look, right? So right now, maybe apartments we are just watching to see what’s happening. But at the same time, there is a lot of opportunities, the good opportunities are coming, right? So there is still some good deals to invest in, but also other asset classes. So diversification is key in my Think Outside the Stocks diversified fund.

We bring in self-storage, multifamily, of course, multifamily as well. And mobile home parks are industrial. So you just have to look. Industrial also has like a tremendous, tremendous opportunity in this market because you know, offshoring is happening and a lot of things. with the chip shortage, Scott, we learned a lot. When this, you know, the the whole fleet of this trucks sat on the on the in the parking lot. we just learned a lot.

Right with the chips. So yeah, you had to just learn where to diversify, right? So I think that is the biggest opportunity. And my fund is mainly focused on commercial real estate, but we are also 20% of it is in businesses. So I want to bring your attention to the opportunity that’s coming up, right? So the next 10 years, the decade, one trillion dollar transfer is happening for businesses. And when I’m talking about businesses,

I’m talking about this mom and papa preter really close to their heart, you know, the baby boomers, they have like cultivated this there as a business. But guess what? The next generation do not want to take this over. And that’s the massive wealth of transfer that’s happening. That the businesses which will not have any ownership, and you know, a consolidation is happening, the roll-ups is happening, and the strategy of identifying this really good performing businesses. and they simply work.

In like you know referral-based knowing the the owner having the connections in the community and with that with the digital era that we are into it if they can be combined with you know the digital marketing putting their brand out there kind of developing that and creating systems and processes and SOPs and kind of scale that and make make that kind of a portfolio bigger which is that my mid tier right the institutional

You know PE firms don’t look at that mid-tier. So consolidate mid-tier and like sell it to the PE firms or institutional buyers. That is a tremendous, tremendous opportunity. So you know those are the two things that I do want to highlight here.

Scott Bursey (30:13)
Madhavi, that was a sensational blueprint for our pros. And you’ve given our pros so much great advice here today. But is there any other words that you can leave with our listeners, our pros?

Madhavi Jain (30:27)
Yeah, absolutely. I think you know, one of the things that you do have to remember that when you are in a situation where there is a lot of fear, right? And I I don’t blame you, right? There’s a lot of fear. I mean, there’s tariffs, there’s war, there is a lot of changes, a lot of things are happening. And you think that okay, I’m just gonna part my money somewhere and you know, lack of good institutions, you put it into savings account. It’s like, okay, I’m getting four percent, four point five percent.

I would say whether it’s in the parking lot in your savings account, whether it’s in your you know, the brokerage account tied to the market cycle, think about it. That are this really serving you, right? I mean, in savings vehicle, when you have about 4%, 5% even interest rate that money market is giving you, remember that that is going off the top tier of your tax packet, right? So whenever that

You know, form comes in and you pay the taxes, that’s 30% plus taxes that you’re paying for that 5%, and plus the inflation is at 3 to 4%, right? It’s negative or net negative, even at being that 5%. So make that money not just your stronger foundation. So think about that: like, where can you park that money? How can I compound it? How can I compound it tax-free? That is your biggest, biggest.

Kind of a partially that that just sitting out there and you’re not utilizing it completely. It can also bring the generational wealth to you. And second thing is that that stock market, right? You know, it has been doing good and but it has its ups and downs. And it’s it’s like that stress and anxiety kind of goes and does that’s that roller coaster right, right? Just imagine, I mean, if what if 2008 happens again, right? And this has, we have seen again and again that you know that 30% lift, the 40% dip dip and takes about

You know few years to recover and what if you’re retiring at that time right so where do you want to do it so Think Outside the Stocks is not just a strategy outside the stocks but it’s really outside the box right if you haven’t heard about something and something is new to you don’t feel fearful about it just you know you and you don’t have to reinvent that view just connect with someone who’s expert and see how much you know knowledge transfer you can take so you can make that informed decision right

So make your savings vehicle vehicle stronger, make your investing vehicle risk managed. If you make money in the stock market, that’s great. But make it realized and put it into tangible assets, that assets that is not paper that you can touch and feel. And then, you know, when I it I talk about the Wealth in a Vault approach, right? It’s about creating that vault, right? It’s not just isolation of savings and investing, but how can you grow, preserve, protect, and pass your generation wealth? Because trust me, Scott.

You know, you and me and people like who are listeners, we have started creating something great with our you know blood, sweat, and tears in this generation. We are building something. We don’t want this to go away in this life or next generations or next generation after that. So we do have to create that tools and techniques. And again, don’t have to reinvent the well. Rockefeller family, for example, they have created these tools and techniques, they have been utilizing it. So think about you know that banking system.

The investing system, diversif diversifying it, asset protection along the line, managing the risk and estate planning, for example, so that it becomes a holistic blueprint. Not only you can keep, but you can pass it on to your next generation because it’s your hard earned money.

Scott Bursey (34:01)
Madhavi, you have really brought the fuel today. And if our listeners want to follow your journey or collaborate with you, what is the best way for them to connect with you?

Madhavi Jain (34:11)
Absolutely. So Think Outside the Stocks is the the brand. And you know, I’m also a podcast host and I do talk about this kind of a variety of opportunities on my podcast. bring the experts and talk about how do they Think Outside the Stocks as well. So that’s number one. And you can go to thinkoutsidethestocks.com. and I actually have some free gifts for you and Scott, if you want, I can send those.

You know, free gifts to our listeners, and those are I have developed some calculators, like I said, that I’m a numbers person and love calculators. I love to show them what it can do for them. so these calculators are you know, the one is the the fire, which is a fire moment, the the independence, the the financial freedom moment to calculate your fire number, and then it also has this savings versus the infinite banking calculator.

You can compare like last 20 years, 30 years, however want to go and look at that. If it was infinite banking and it is the money market, how is that performed? And it has a beautiful chart there. It also has an calculator for rental versus syndication. And the and asset, if you do the investing and do the infinite banking together, which my god is like an exponential benefit. And I love that strategy. So you can see yourself how does this number move. So I’ll give you that link and a QR code.

And you can share it with an audience because I’m intensely careful grateful for your audience to listening to to me, just I you know, adding my thoughts and my perspective into it, and just letting allowing me to to be there with with along with their journey.

Scott Bursey (35:51)
Madhavi, thank you so much for that.

Madhavi Jain (35:54)
Absolutely. Thank you so much.

Scott Bursey (35:56)
This has been an absolute masterclass. Thank you so much for joining us.

Madhavi Jain (36:01)
Thank you so much, Scott, for tonight.

Scott Bursey (36:03)
It’s been our pleasure. Thank you once again.

Madhavi Jain (36:07)
Thank you.

Scott Bursey (36:09)
And to our listeners, we appreciate you. If you got value from today’s episode, please subscribe. We’ll be filling your tanks with the lineup of elite guests just like Madhavi, who are accelerating and setting the pace for the rest of the industry. Until next time, keep your standards high and your vision clear. We’ll see you in the next episode, everyone.