How to Scale a Real Estate Investing Business Without Creating Another Job

Mark Stubler (00:00)
for me, we get into this industry for more time and money. And that time is because you probably want to spend more time with your loved ones.

You want to, you know, have an impact in your home. I’m fortunate enough to have four kids. I have one son and three daughters. I’ve been married for almost 23 years. And I spent my almost my entire day yesterday with my, with my spouse and I’m busy.

Scott Bursey (01:59)
Welcome back to the Real Estate Pros Podcast powered by Investor Fuel. I’m your host Scott Bursey and today we have a powerhouse in the house.

This man has built a massive business around solving problems for sellers, scaling his operation, and creating a blueprint for others to follow. He is bringing that high octane fuel we need to ignite our own businesses. Get ready to level up your acquisition game. Today we are talking to Mark Stubler of Joe Homebuyer. Mark, welcome to the show.

Mark Stubler (02:29)
Hey Scott, thanks for having me on. Grateful to be with you.

Scott Bursey (02:32)
It is wonderful having you with us. And for those of our listeners who may not be familiar with your journey, please tell us how did your career begin and what is your main focus now?

Mark Stubler (02:42)
Well, I love the question. It’s always fun to talk about the journey because we all start somewhere. Mine started in cells, right? Just a lot of, you know, early days of cells was as a missionary for my church, knocking on doors, talking about the best product to offer, and that’s Jesus. And that evolved into later years in my early 20s into selling alarms and then selling fencing and decking. But I’ve now been in real estate, Scott, for over 10 years. Started in Utah.

started getting some exceptional success, surrounded myself with just an incredible team and business partner and that led to growing a franchise and now we have franchise partners all throughout the country. So it’s been a fun journey over last 10 years and we’ve learned a lot throughout the process obviously, both of what not to do, Scott, as well as what to do and I can talk about both. I’ve certainly made mistakes along the way but I’m grateful for the journey.

Scott Bursey (03:41)
It sounds like you are on a great path and this is gonna be a wonderful discussion. Mark, if someone’s listening to this and they’re thinking, hey, this is somebody that I like to partner with, what would you like them to know first about your business?

Mark Stubler (03:56)
Yeah, I appreciate the question. you know, it’s our industry so fruitful and provides so much opportunity, but the truth is we all hit plateaus or ceilings at some point. And so our framework at Joe Homebuyer, when we partnered with franchisees, is we help individuals scale and grow their business, break through that plateau and do some special things because we have to scale and grow as individuals, as leaders, but then we need to employ the right strategies. We need to know when to hire, who to hire.

We need a playbook to optimize. ⁓ And so many people make money in this industry because the industry is forgiving. You’re good at sales, many people can make money. But if you want it to be an actual business that works for you instead of you just working for it, then you need to be pretty strategic. You need to be mindful of exactly what strategy you’re going to employ ⁓ because in a perfect world, you can enjoy more time and money. Because guess what? That’s the reason you got into the industry. You wanted more time and money. I mean, that’s the universal answer.

I’m getting into real estate because I want more time and I want more money. And that is actually an option, even within wholesaling and rehabbing and the traditional single-family investments. But you have to be very intentional about how you scale and grow your business. So that’s what we have specialized in and helped build strategic partners throughout the country that can help scale and grow their business. That’s what we have a good time doing because we understand the model. understand. In the early days, Scott, I have to tell the story. I got going in Utah.

And in one year, I had it all figured out, so I thought, that I instantly thought, well, now we’re ready to expand into Indiana. Well, guess who wasn’t ready to expand into Indiana? Me. Because I didn’t know what I was doing. I was a year in, and I was already trying to add markets, and I was trying to do some cool things. Now, the irony is I started making money in Indiana. So what’s the problem? Well, the problem is I started losing traction in Utah. I didn’t have the infrastructure. I really hadn’t been developed as a leader. And worst off,

Probably the biggest problem is I didn’t have clarity on what I actually wanted my business to be how I wanted to operate So now I’m in multiple markets just running around with my head cut off. All I’ve done is just add an additional job I haven’t I haven’t actually created the framework for a legitimate business And so that’s the distinction is there’s a time and a place to get super ambitious scale and grow do big things But do it strategically so that you’re not just adding more headaches You’re you’re strategically growing with the process that affords you more time and freedom

and ultimately time with your family along the way.

Scott Bursey (06:22)
Mark, I love that framing. I really do. That’s outstanding. I agree with you 100%. What do you feel is the biggest opportunity right now for you and Joe homebuyer?

Mark Stubler (07:24)
Well, for us, we’re very much on a path for growth. And for us, it’s about being intentional about the decisions for growth, strategically growing with the right franchisees. But as it relates to the market and just wearing the hat of an investor, because I still have my own local operation in addition to the franchise partners throughout the country. So I’m very much still in the trenches. And what I think sometimes people

forget is growth is very much I think synonymous with the word decision. You just have to be strategic about the decisions you make. And your next decision is more important than any past mistakes you made. Because we’re all going to make mistakes. We’re all going to think we made a calculated decision and ended up not being fruitful, whether it’s a marketing decision, whether it’s a bad hire. But oftentimes we stymie our growth because we don’t have, we’re not addressing the harder.

hard to build a nice culture in your business. It’s harder to have a toxic culture. It’s hard to find the right hire. It’s harder to stick with the dude that just is status quo and is not helping you scale and grow. So it’s making the deliberate decisions to face the harder. So for us, the greatest opportunity in this path for growth is making the strategic decision. So I believe that is going to be in building and scaling my team.

So I’m very strategic about who I hire and what standards I have in my operation. I’ve been guilty of times of keeping someone because of just the loyalty. I like them, but they weren’t necessarily producing. ⁓ Or I’ve certainly been guilty of saying I need to hire somebody, but I’ve been reluctant to do so. it’s been too daunting because it takes too much energy and effort. So I’m just kind of stuck in status quo. So we know that the greatest opportunity is

development within ourselves to say, right, clarity, this is where I’m going. This is what I need to accomplish. And then making the decisions to out and do it. And for us, it’s for our rapid growth, we’re looking for the right team members to help us scale and grow.

Scott Bursey (09:31)
Awesome breakdown. Mark, how do you acquire the top talent?

Mark Stubler (09:38)
A lot of effort. It always takes 10 times more work than you think, right? But the top talent makes all the difference. We know all the greats. When you ask the best businesses, the best leaders out there, it seems like they have a unanimous response that the success of your business is largely proportional to just the amount of A players they have on their team. We’ve all heard it said different ways, but essentially it’s you want to know how good your business is or where your business is going?

It’s in direct relation to the amount of A players you have on your team. So we have to surround, yeah, how do you keep them? How do you motivate them? How do you create an atmosphere where they stay, right? So the first part of your question is how do you find them? It’s a lot of effort. Obviously, we always start with network because I’m always wanting to find people that even if it’s two or three people removed,

Scott Bursey (10:08)
How do you keep?

Mark Stubler (10:30)
Within your network or other high-level professionals that you know there’s oftentimes somebody that’s looking the other thing you need to be looking for somebody that Doesn’t it probably isn’t looking for a job They’re probably gainfully employed doing some special things and you can be their next chapter in their life by providing them that you know a new opportunity So it’s a lot of effort. It’s all the things. It’s the networking. It’s the all the the typical platforms for posting jobs

massive amounts of interviews but it’s getting super clear on on who you want now i don’t bet a thousand i’ve i i still have made hires that i thought were a players and they’re not but i’m i’m able to make quick pivots if i ever get myself in a position where i you know brought on the wrong individual but keeping an individual is the other you know side of the coin like you can may attract somebody but guess what you’re not going to retain them if they think that you’re a slouch of a leader if you’re not providing them vision

If they don’t see where the company’s going or have clarity on how they can contribute to something greater than themselves, an A player is going to leave. If an A player doesn’t feel like they’re challenged, that’s right. If they don’t feel like they have accountability or that they don’t have something that they’re contributing to or that they’re going to be held to a standard, a true A player is not going to find that environment attractive. They’re not going find it challenging enough. And so a culture of winning, a culture of clarity, a culture of accountability,

in my mind is what we’re thriving for to retain talent.

Scott Bursey (11:52)
Mark, that was an excellent breakdown. Thank you for that. And I’ll do a different pivot now. Any challenges you’re watching closely, this could be market risk, competition, access to deals or capital, you know, that sort of thing.

Mark Stubler (12:42)
Yeah, I actually I’d say that one of the biggest challenges that wholesalers are starting to see is regulations throughout the country. Investors are seeing this. I see it as an opportunity. I believe it’s an opportunity for the bad actors to get weeded out. And the truth is, because the only barrier to entry for wholesaling ⁓ is a YouTube video, it means that unfortunately we have some bad actors. We have some undeveloped individuals

putting houses under contract and putting sellers in a precarious situation, misrepresenting their intentions. And as a result, our industry is tarnished to some level because of the bad actors. At the same token, I’ve seen lots of individuals that do investing the right way, that are very intentional about how they interact with sellers, the value that they provide. So that’s actually really encouraging. But the biggest threat

that I think people perceive is regulation, when in reality, regulation doesn’t have to be a negative thing. So long as the regulation is in check, that it actually is equitable for both sides, the seller and the buyer, but that the seller is, in fact, protected. Now, there’s less bad actors. The barrier to entry is a little more complex, whether it’s you need to be a licensed agent, whether you need to put more earnest money down, whether the…

consumer, the seller in this case, needs to be better educated. All of those things really don’t have to be a negative thing. And it actually could be a catalyst for growth for those that do it the right way. They could leverage this platform as an opportunity to go deep and capture more market share. And that’s often how, throughout time, that’s often how many of the large corporations and businesses have grown is through market turns, they see it as an opportunity. They figure when there’s less competition, what can they do now to go capture more?

Market share and so I think if we see some of the threats now interest rates and you know ⁓ certainly global and Economic changes could all be threats. We can’t control any of that So I put almost zero time and energy towards that what we do know is there’s always somebody that’s inheriting a bad home We do know that there’s always families that get themselves either in a inherit a problem or create a problem and they need a solution so regardless of what the economy is doing and that sort of thing so

I can only focus on the controllables. I can only continue to provide meaningful service and value to the sellers. And so I’m going to focus on those things. And I do see one of the most popular topics that are talked, that it’s discussed, is this regulation being actually a positive thing for those that are serious about creating meaningful businesses.

Scott Bursey (15:23)
That’s right, 100%. Mark, if you could only execute one action this quarter to maximize the current market, what would it be?

Mark Stubler (16:13)
There is an opportunity to specialize in everything that we do. I alluded to this a little bit. Well, but you want one thing. So I was going to be careful. I was going go down a couple. if you’re going to specialize, I think you’re going to find that a forgotten strategy in our industry is really specializing. And it’s partly because just the nature of how quick we are to streamline our efforts. Like, oh, I want

you know direct mail provider i’m gonna have to pull the list i’m gonna have to send them mail pieces i’m even gonna use a i’d answer the phone and i’m gonna do is be the warm body that goes on the appointment or i might even ask a i’d try to you know put it under contract you know that’s all fun but the end of the day there’s gaps in that logic and and i would tell you that they’re still money in the service side of things in the specializing side of things and so you as it relates specifically to marketing there’s an opportunity to specialize

whether it’s a life situation marketing list, if you identify, for example, probate or even just something, not that this is a list that people don’t talk about all the time, but even just notice a default or whatever or a vacant property, get to the point where you’re the best in the business in your market at that strategy. Specializing is, I think, an area that we’re focused on to continue to scale and grow is, all what are we continually doing to be

to optimize, to continually refine. It’s just that old adage of like, okay, we’re putting money in the machine and it’s producing results, but you ask the question of what is the one thing I could do to grow or scale or improve. I’m still putting money in that machine, but where can I optimize by pulling that lever where I can actually pump out more, where it would get better results? so specializing is my answer, is figuring out ways that you can go deep and really just be…

the market leader on that topic and you can add to it over time versus I think it’s so often people are doing the reverse of that. They’re trying to systemize everything through AI and get themselves, you know, replace any human interaction with machines and things and I think you’re missing the opportunity. This is going to remain a service business. Sure, there’ll be AI, there’ll be iBuyers, there’ll be electronic offers, there’ll be all those things and that’s great. There’s going to be a place for that.

But there’s also a great place to specialize as a service provider and to be the one knee to knee, belly to belly, providing real value to sellers. And there’s always going to be that demographic of people that are wanting that type of interaction. And that’s where I’m going to go deep.

Scott Bursey (18:44)
that human relationships are so critical.

Mark Stubler (18:47)
as it is. mean, you just can’t replace, in our industry particularly, providing a seller certainty. And honestly, that should be one of the more rewarding aspects of what we do, is this idea that I’m identifying ways that I can provide meaningful service. when I’m investing time with sellers, I’m identifying ways that nobody else has of what the seller needs. And I’m getting a lot of enjoyment. I’m providing them clarity. I’m providing them certainty.

That can be and should be one of the more rewarding things of our industry and what we do.

Scott Bursey (19:18)
Absolutely. Couldn’t agree with you more. Thank you for that breakdown. Is there any words of advice or some golden nuggets you’d like to leave with our listeners here today,

Mark Stubler (19:29)
Well, I know you have a variety of people that listen, which is awesome. And at the end of the day, I’ve shared some of the things that are probably from a tactical or some of the areas that I’m focused. But I guess I’d circle back around to kind of where we started that,

for me, we get into this industry for more time and money. And that time is because you probably want to spend more time with your loved ones.

You want to, you know, have an impact in your home. I’m fortunate enough to have four kids. I have one son and three daughters. I’ve been married for almost 23 years. And I spent my almost my entire day yesterday with my, with my spouse and I’m busy.

have, I have, for some of you, you’ll laugh at this. have tasks for days and others. I’ll tell you, I’ve got sticky notes for days, meaning I’ve got lots of stuff to do. I’ve got lots of unread.

emails or unread things, but that is you can’t wait until to start living the way that you you know with the In other words you have to design the life that you want today so if I’m sharing anything with those observing it’s if I wait and tell I Have you know all the money or the achievement or the final success? To to spend more time am I really gonna spend more time or is it actually ever even gonna happen?

And so I share that I’m not perfect at it and I don’t always spend Wednesday with my spouse. But if we get super clear on what we want, then we can be super intentional about our activities. And if I know that I a meaningful relationship with my wife, then I would schedule time in, even if it means that I’m not able to attend a meeting or I have to push something off because I got into it for that reason. And you and I talked, I think it might have been off recording about, you

Faith, know, faith is being, you know, who I am and why I do things, a greater purpose, family and freedom. But that’s the one I didn’t hit in depth yet is the faith. Like, what is it that’s driving you? Who’s driving you? ⁓ I believe that the obstacles in your business are perfectly for you. That it’s all part of your progression and experience, so long as you see it that way and as you embrace it, right?

⁓ I believe we each have an opportunity to be directed by a supreme being that will guide and direct us and influence us in our lives, in our families, in our businesses. So I also, you know, would be remiss if I didn’t at least challenge people to tap into the source in everything that they do. And I’m not perfect at this. I don’t want to sound like I’m, you know, a disciple here of great experience, but I will say that in the times that I do ⁓ live true to that character or true to that principle,

I have observed great reward and often the interesting thing is the more that you focus on the faith, the more you’re driven back to your family. The more that the true important things are highlighted in your life. And then when those things are in check, then you’ll be propelled to make the right decisions. You’ll have the right opportunities to scale and grow your business. But if it’s all things business and you’re not really

⁓ in focusing on these other things, I think that you’re gonna find that you may never actually get the full more time and more money that you went into this industry approaching or seeking.

Scott Bursey (22:59)
faith, family, and freedom. Mark, this has been Pure Gold. Before we sign off, I know our pros are gonna wanna connect with you. For those of our listeners who want to follow you, collaborate with you, what is the best way for them to reach you?

Mark Stubler (23:14)
Yeah, so I’m on Instagram, Mark Stubler, S-T-U-B-L-E-R, just as it sounds, I guess. And then you can find me if you’re interested in a potential partnership. Say your business is at a certain level and you’re just kind of a plateau. Or even say you’re starting to grow and you haven’t hit the plateau yet. You just want to accelerate the pace of which you grow and scale your operation. You really ought to consider Joe Homebuyer. And you can find us at joehomebuyerfranchising.com.

We’re really selective. have to have an existing operation. have to be growing and scaling with an existing marketing budget. But there are those that are ready to scale and grow and be the market leaders in their specific markets. And we want to help you scale and grow, leveraging our brand, our playbook, our community, best practices. So you can find me at joehomebuyerfranchising.com

Scott Bursey (24:02)
Mark Stubler, everybody. Mark, thank you for joining us today.

Mark Stubler (24:07)
Hey Scott, thanks for having me.

Scott Bursey (24:08)
And to our listeners, we appreciate each and every one of you. Until next time, keep your standards high and your vision clear. We’ll see you in the next episode, everyone.