Hidden Probate Deals: Sharon Vornholt’s Strategy for Off-Market Real Estate Leads

Sharon Vornholt (00:00)
But these folks are so happy when you can take the, it’s like a noose around their neck, quite frankly. They just want to be done. You know, it’s a hard time for them.

But probate is a legal process that is required by law in most instances if you own property, unless you’ve done some really fancy estate planning and you’ve got everything in trust, your property is going to have to go through probate and they just want to be done.

Quentin (02:00)
Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Real Estate Pros podcast. I am your host Q Edmonds, and I am excited to be here today. I have a true professional here and someone that I am graciously indebted to. I appreciate her patience, her grace. And I just, I’m so glad that she’s here. I believe we’re going to learn a lot of different nuggets from this lady here. And she is proficient.

at what she does, years of experience. And so I am so elated to get into the journey of Ms. Sharon Vornholt Ms. Sharon, how you doing today, I am doing great. I am doing great. Again, I appreciate your grace. Thank you so much. And listen, Ms. Sharon, I’m the type to like to dive right in. I would love to know what is your main focus these days?

Sharon Vornholt (02:38)
I’m great, how are you?

Quentin (02:54)
If you can give us a little bit of an origin story, kind of how you got started within the space. And also tell them what part of the world you’re in. People love to know where people are geographically. And so Sharon, you have the floor.

Sharon Vornholt (03:06)
there. I’m Sharon Vornholt and I am in Louisville, Kentucky. And for those of you that are familiar with this area know that this is a national holiday here. It’s Derby week, the Kentucky Derby. So we’re doing all things Derby here, but I got started in 1998, which was the same year that I went to my very first real meeting and I bought my first property, a fix and flip, which I probably don’t advise that that be your first project.

but that’s what I did first. And I went along that path for about 10 years because I had another business. So I call it the slow and steady path where you keep your day job and you can still borrow money to do fix and flips. Then in 2008, which was the best of both worlds and the worst of the world,

Everything was just as a real estate meltdown. And that year I became an accidental wholesaler, which is quite comical to me today because I had never wholesaled a single property up until that point. I either rehabbed it and sold it, or I held on to a few of them. But the market was tough. And if you weren’t around in 2008, you don’t know that it was

practically impossible for buyers, especially first time home buyers to get a mortgage. So I had to flip my business on its side. And the other thing that I had to do very quickly, and I learned this from my buyers on my list, was that what would make a good fix and flip ⁓ last year wouldn’t necessarily be good this year because it wouldn’t necessarily cash flow. So now you had to have a property that they could sell and make money.

But if they couldn’t sell it, which was very often the reality, it had the cash flow.

So we all, like to say we were all kind of learning together the different, what was a good deal six months ago wasn’t necessarily a good deal today. Coincidentally, around that time, I discovered probates. All of this was in 2008. So I discovered that niche that there were

a steady stream of these every single month and it’s the cycle of life. You know, people are born and people pass away. But I had no idea what to do with these. You know, I didn’t know what was probate, exactly how probate worked. It took a while to figure all of that out for the state of Kentucky. And then I figured out that it works pretty much the same almost everywhere.

There are a few states where the process is more cumbersome, California being one of them. But for the vast majority of the states, it is a simple process that is no different. Once the probate is opened, you go through the same exact steps that you do with any other property. The thing I love about probates, well, there are several things. Well, number one is their

They are completely unaffected by market conditions. Good market, bad market doesn’t matter. The probates are still going to be there. And these people really need our help. So you are able to do a lot of good working with probates. And the reason is that if you stop and think about your own life, know, I’ll look at people that have small children.

They’ve got a job, they’ve got their kids, they’ve got soccer games, they’ve got all the things that they normally do. And now all of a sudden, they’ve got this estate they have to settle. And one of the things that they have to do is dispose of the property. Now in probate, one thing that is different is that if you’re buying a property in probate is that everything has to be converted to cash so that the heirs get what they’re inheriting. So there’s no creative finance.

that you can do within probate. But it just means that you have to have private money or you have to have a source of money. That’s the only difference. You’re going to have to buy the property or you can wholesale it. So there is always that.

But these folks are so happy when you can take the, it’s like a noose around their neck, quite frankly. They just want to be done. You know, it’s a hard time for them.

But probate is a legal process that is required by law in most instances if you own property, unless you’ve done some really fancy estate planning and you’ve got everything in trust, your property is going to have to go through probate and they just want to be

They want to move on with their life. And I can truthfully say that I have gotten more hugs at probate closings than any other kind of closing. It’s praise the Lord, you got me out of this and I’m done.

I can now move on.

Quentin (08:55)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I appreciate you taking us through the journey. I was actively listening as you was talking. I was actually just writing some things down. And so ⁓ I’m gonna take some things back to you, because I wanna make a statement and ask you a question. So in Kentucky, it’s derby season. I’m in Laurel, the preakness is coming to Laurel. So this is me, and we’ll be getting that soon, right? So yeah, so that’s right around the corner. ⁓

Started this in 1998, started fixing flips. You advise people, hey, let’s not start there. So I started fixing flips. 2008, you kind of became an accidental wholesaler. But also around that time, you discovered ProBates. And so, and you learn it works everywhere. So you was able to go in different places. And I love how you said at the end, you get more hugs when it comes to ProBates than anything else, right?

Sharon Vornholt (09:36)
Mm-hmm.

Quentin (09:51)
I love it. We can get more hugs. one of my love languages, physical touch. So I love, but I love your journey. And I have a saying, Sharon, I have a saying Sharon, where I say destiny has no wasted moments.

You know, like destiny, the moments are building and fortifying the people that we are today. And we borrow from each leg of the journey. So Sharon, would love to know throughout the journey, throughout the moments, what have they taught you about yourself?

Has it you discipline, resilience, innovation? Like what is the moments taught you about you?

Sharon Vornholt (11:01)
Well, I think they’ve certainly taught me resilience. I’ve always been a lifelong learner. So innovation is definitely part of that because when I talk about 2008, if you weren’t here at that time, people, was easy to sell properties. In fact, I had an agent tell me one time and I don’t recommend this, but he would say, if they’re breathing and they have a job, I can get a mortgage.

When 2008 came, that ended very badly for a lot of people. But when I said I had to turn on a, know, change my business model on a dime, that is 100 % true. Because my business model no longer worked if my in buyer, you know, if you are rehabbing bread and butter homes or even wholesaling bread and butter homes, and the person you’re selling that property to cannot get a mortgage, whether it’s a commercial mortgage,

Maybe a lot of the private money lenders got really kind of scared during that time. What’s going to happen to my money if this plan of theirs doesn’t work out? But I think you have to be able to turn and in any market that’s true, there’s an agent in my area who’s probably, he’s an investor too. He might be 90, I don’t really know. He’s older, but he will tell you I’ve made money when…

interest rates were 3%. And I’ve also made money when they were 18%. I just did it differently. So that talks to resilience and being able to innovate and you have to step back and instead of, and you have to somehow get out of the terror mode of, of all of that and go, okay, what, what is the problem? Put, leave the scared feelings over here, push them out the door.

and then go, what can I do to change my reality? And I think that’s where entrepreneurs excel. They learn that and you’re not born knowing it, but each hiccup you get, each setback that comes along in the journey, you have to figure it out or go out of business. It’s just that simple.

Quentin (13:17)
Thank you for that reflective, self-aware answer. I appreciate it. I know people is going to glean a lot from that insight and that wisdom that you just gave. I love asking people that question. I knew I was going to love asking you that because it just reveals so much about the journey and people that’s watching. There are different parts of the journey. And I want them to know that momentum is building and that if you go through adversity, you’re going to get through it. If you peek back,

You’ve been through some things before and you’ll get through this as well. And so again, I just appreciate you answering that. ⁓ What’s next for you, Sharon? Like, what’s your next goal? What are you looking to solve at scale next?

Sharon Vornholt (13:56)
Well, I love teaching, which is so odd because I never had the slightest interest in ever being a teacher. I was the scientific figure it out medical minded person. But ⁓ in another lifetime, I actually managed medical practices. ⁓ it was, but I love teaching and it was, it was a real, ⁓ it was kind of hard when I discovered probates because

Quentin (14:09)
this one.

Sharon Vornholt (14:24)
There were no mentors, there were no courses. was, you know, barely the internet was still very young, you know, at that time when it came to its ability to put information together. So I’m very passionate about teaching people about this because they’re scared of it. They think it’s weird or strange or somebody’s going to say, let me tell you about my horrible passing of my mother. And I could tell you that in

more than 20 years, no one has ever said that to me. They want to know how you can help them get through this.

So what I love about off market deals is that you get to talk directly to the people. And I’ve worked with agents virtually since I had my other business since 1991. And I love agents, but there is nothing like an investor being able to sit down with a seller and find out.

what the problem is. And in the case of probates or any other thing, even if they’re in foreclosure, there’s almost always another problem. So you need to just have a conversation. I like to say like you would like you and I are having. If I said Q, you need to sell your house, you’ve got the properties in probate, but what else, is there another problem? And they might say, I didn’t realize it, but my parents haven’t paid their property taxes for three years. Then you say, don’t worry about it.

We can wrap that into the closing. You just talk to them, your offer. Or I didn’t know it, but my parents have all these code violations and there’s a lien on the property. Then you say, don’t worry about it. I can fix that problem for you. So that’s how you work with probates. And the other thing I do with probates is I look for visual clues in the house. People always think it’s weird. It’s going to be weird talking to these people.

But if I walked into your property that you were showing me and I knew your ⁓ dad had passed away, I might see golf clubs in the corner and I would say, ⁓ was your dad the golfer? It does not matter what the answer is. If the answer is yes, then, my brother’s a golfer or my uncle’s a golfer. ⁓ If they say no, those were my brother’s, say, well, that’s interesting. But you can build rapport with sellers.

Quentin (17:10)
Yeah.

Sharon Vornholt (17:27)
very easily once you learn this thing. And it might be that you look around the kitchen and you see a bunch of cookbooks and then you would say, was your mom the cook? Yes, she had every holiday here. And growing up and this house has a special meaning for me. But part of your job is to be a good listener. And that’s what any real estate strategy, off-market strategy, where you need to build that rapport very quickly. But it’s very easy once you know the tricks.

Quentin (17:58)
Well, I’m love asking you this question, Sharon, because you deal with people, probates, and this word, I think it’s going to get an insight from you, particularly to this word I’m going love, the word relationship. So when you hear the word relationship from your vantage point, what comes to mind for you?

Sharon Vornholt (18:00)
you

Well, the relationship for me is all about how you can help someone. I think for me, I’ll look at it as how can I help with that, thinking about what’s in it for me. But I can promise you that if you’re, whether you’re networking or building this type of a relationship, you could be at your real meeting networking. If you can help someone else, it will always come back to you many times over.

And that’s the way I think you should look at it. Not necessarily, well, I’m going to do this for you, but what can you do for me? So that never really ends well.

Quentin (18:56)
One of my, I have a little proverb that I say when it talks about like servitude. And it says, when you refresh others, you in return will be refreshed. And so I feel like just, yeah, know, point blank, you know, period. just, when you serve people well, it, got to come back to you and it comes back so many different ways. It could be referrals. It could be just you feeling good about, you know, what you’re doing, knowing that you’re, you’re adding value, keeping people out of tough situations. It just comes back in so many different ways. so.

Sharon Vornholt (19:03)
Mm-hmm, exactly.

Mm-hmm.

Quentin (19:25)
I appreciate that.

Sharon Vornholt (19:27)
Well, people should know it might not come back tomorrow. I have had people contact me four or five years later to say, remember this whatever event or whatever. And I thought of you when this came up. So you never know. I think it’s important that you from a brand perspective, which is something I’ve.

talk about all the time, marketing is how you get leads, but branding is why they choose you over somebody else. So when you think about branding, yes, your physical attributes are the colors and the fonts and all of that, but branding at its core is, as someone said, it’s what people say about you when you leave the room. It is, gee, cute. He is so easy to work with, or dang, he is just so much trouble.

You know, if you run your business from that point of view, how can I be of service and someday, you know, I know good things will happen. You just can’t go wrong. You know, you want to be known as the person who always does what they say they’re going to do. And that’s very important with sellers. If you say, I’ll have this for you at nine o’clock and you can’t have, let’s say the contract by nine o’clock, something happened.

You just contact them and say, look, I know I told you this, but I’ve had this glitch. I’ll contact you in the morning. Is that okay with you? And they’re going to say, sure. But if you leave them hanging, then they’re going to say, well, that didn’t work out. He didn’t keep his word. She didn’t keep her word. So I think that always be thinking in every interaction in real estate with this seller, a realtor, another investor.

Always be thinking about walking away leaving the brand and the memory of you that you want them to remember.

Quentin (21:30)
previous guests, said, everyone has a brand and that brand is your character. And I was like, wow, that’s why I’m on this.

Sharon Vornholt (21:33)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Your reputation, it’s

what you… And if you don’t build your own brand, somebody else will build it for you. Let’s say somebody got mad at you two years ago and they’re saying, ⁓ well, listen, that cue, whatever, whatever, whatever, listen, that’s Sharon. I remember a time. So you don’t ever want that. So you need to be in charge of your reputation, your integrity, do what you say you’re going to do and…

organically, we’re not talking about doing anything fancy here, we’re talking about being a good person, showing up when you say you’re going to show up or letting them know if you can’t show up. It’s what I call common sense things, but over time, people will know that you keep your word and that is the death of your business if you don’t do that.

Quentin (22:30)
So well said, Sharon. Listen, if someone wanted to reach out to you, connect with you, collaborate with you, learn more about what you’re doing, how can they get in contact with you?

Sharon Vornholt (22:40)
They can email me, they can look at my name here under the video. They can contact me at [email protected]. That’s probably the easiest way to remember. If you want to check out my probate course, that is probateinvestingsimplified.com. And that’s my goal. And that is what I’ve done with that course is to make it simple and easy to follow and take the mystery out of it for people.

And I have a new program that’s going to be coming out that’s called Scaling Your Pro-Bate Business that will also be for any off-market deals. This is the process is, you know, the six pillars of scaling. If you are a small business person, I’m not talking about a huge business that has 50 VAs. If you are a solopreneur or a small business person with a few contractors,

This is for you because I’m going to show you exactly how to scale your marketing, how to build that brand very organically. And there are six pillars in this course. it will be out within 30 days or less.

Quentin (23:51)
I love it. Listen, I thank you. So let me say three things to you. And I say this sincerely. First thing, thank you for your time. I value your time. I appreciate your grace and patience. Thank you so much for your time. I truly believe time is our most precious commodity. And so thank you. I appreciate your time. Secondly, thank you for your story. Thank you for your authenticity, your transparency, even what I call like the gift of your vulnerability.

I believe stories have a way of planting seeds in people. We may not see the growth tomorrow. We may not see it two months from now, maybe five years from now we may not see it, but that seed is there. And I know you planted some seeds today. So thank you for your story. And lastly, thank you for your mindset, the way you think and bringing that mindset to this platform. I greatly appreciate you. Thank you so much.

Sharon Vornholt (24:27)
Hmm?

Well, thank you for having me. And I’d like to leave everybody with one final thought. And that is we all started out and didn’t know a darn thing. We all got to where we are. For me, it’s been a long time. But for everyone, invest in your education, invest in your mentors, and know that you will grow. But everybody starts out at the same exact place.

Quentin (25:10)
Listen, with what Sharon said, that’s the mic drop moment. Listen, definitely check out Sharon. Please look in the show notes. All her information is there. Definitely make sure you are subscribed here because we’re going to bring up continually amazing people just like Sharon. So thank you so much again. And everyone else, you’ll have a fantastic day.