Commercial Real Estate Investing Tips: Earnest Money, Brokers, Office Deals & Multifamily Opportunities

Michael Bull, CCIM (00:00)
not only am I going to put a million dollars in this money down, you told me you’re going to present this offer in person. Is that correct? I said, yes, ma’am. She said, all right, not only am going to write a million dollars money check, you’re going to take the check to the presentation. You’re going to turn it around and you’re going to slide it in front of them. And I said, yes, ma’am, I am certainly going to do that.

Cody Crabb (01:54)
Welcome back to the Real Estate Pros podcast. I’m Cody Crabb with Investor Fuel. Today we’re joined by Michael Bull, founder of Bull Realty, headquartered in Atlanta. Michael brings 35 years of commercial and multifamily real estate experience across the Southeast, leading a 50 person brokerage team that helps clients buy, sell, and lease properties across every major asset class. ⁓ Michael, thank you so much for joining us today.

Michael Bull, CCIM (02:19)
Thank you, Cody. Glad to be with you.

Cody Crabb (02:22)
So you’ve had 35 years in commercial and multifamily real estate. I mean, you’re seeing deals across the Southeast, between asset classes. I’m ⁓ curious. for investors listening right now, ⁓ let’s just get, I would love to hear a little bit about your story, about kind of how you got to be where you are. And then we can dive into your experience and get some, ⁓ get some information, not some information, but some good advice and some help for our listeners.

Michael Bull, CCIM (02:49)
Yeah.

Well, sure. Well, to talk about my how I got started in brevity, I when I was in college, I was managing apartments during the day. At 19, I got my license.

At 22, I became a commissioned only investment sales broker and focused on apartments, multifamily in Atlanta. And then 28 years ago, I started Bull Realty and we grew from there and now service all sectors and property types all across the southeast US.

That’s how I got started was managing and operating properties. And that kind of helped me to know how to put deals together and help buyers pick the right properties and help sell or sell them.

Cody Crabb (03:36)
Yeah, that’s great. that’s a lot of our listeners are probably kind of in the same arena. For people listening that are trying to step into commercial or kind of make better deals, I’d love to hear kind of where do you think some opportunities are right now in the market?

Michael Bull, CCIM (03:52)
Yeah. Well, in commercial estate market, some of the opportunities right now are in distressed apartments. ⁓ Some of the deals that got put together with the height of the interest rates that had financing now that’s gotten ⁓ too high ⁓ and a market that slowed down. So there’s good opportunities, I think, in all sorts of multifamily. I think other opportunities are in office, ⁓ especially if you’re a user.

So I think anyone that’s a listener that uses office space for their business, I think you really want to see if you can match that with an acquisition right now in office. The last six office buildings we’ve taken out to market around the Southeast were all won by partial users. you know, because partial users get better financing, they feel part of the problem with the vacancy. And it’s just a really good time while

Cody Crabb (04:38)
Hmm.

Yeah

Michael Bull, CCIM (04:49)
we’re in a low value range for office properties.

Cody Crabb (04:53)
Yeah, it’s like house hacking, but with your business, that’s brilliant. ⁓ Well, that’s pretty neat. So I think ⁓ because you’ve got so much experience across asset classes, I think our listeners are kind of interested in what to look at and where to go and things. But maybe a little bit of kind of how did you get into commercial specifically ⁓ might be helpful because there’s so many different routes you can go.

I’m curious what kind of drew you here.

Michael Bull, CCIM (06:11)
Yeah. Well, the first property ever sold was a 20 unit apartment deal. And since I knew how to run apartments and knew a good deal when I saw it, was, it was sort of natural. You know, I did have a few friends or whatever clients that asked me to do houses every now and again. And every time I did, I regretted it. It was always something weird or strange or I don’t know, emotional or

Cody Crabb (06:33)
you

Michael Bull, CCIM (06:37)
I don’t know, it just was always a little weird. And so I’ve always just enjoyed commercial real estate. It’s a little more logical and ⁓ it’s a little more complex. So you can add a lot more value. You know, I felt like when I was selling a house, was commodity, you know, I wasn’t that much different from my fellow agents. So, but in commercial real estate, you can keep improving your skills just constantly. And your experience ⁓ is…

incredible after in a certain number of deals that value to clients is really strong. So it feels really good in commercial brokerage that the value we add for clients, they just really appreciate us and it’s very fulfilling.

Cody Crabb (07:21)
Yeah, I think that’s a good point because I’ve never really thought about that, but like, technically, as a single-family realtor…

you’re not really doing anything that they technically couldn’t do themselves. I mean, you are, of course you are, but to a point where there’s apps and things that have kind of replaced realtors and things. when you’re getting into the commercial world, there’s a whole lot more nuance and different asset classes and different, there’s so many different things, whereas a single family, you’re kind of looking at the same stuff every time. So that’s definitely something to, that’s something to think about for sure. So.

I want go back to that partial users idea. I think that’s a pretty brilliant ⁓ idea. So what kind of mistakes would you see if somebody was, know, somebody’s thinking, that’s a that’s a great idea. I should dive into that. What mistakes might you see somebody make if they wanted to do that partial user buying their own building idea?

Michael Bull, CCIM (08:14)
One would be not to buy too small. You know, if your business is not growing, it’s dying, right? So one mistake would be buying a, you know, oh, I need 4842 square feet trying to buy something that size. think it’s best if you can buy something a little larger that maybe you’re renting out other space so that you have room to grow. The other is to make sure it’s the right location for your business. I think the business

really comes first. You don’t want to go in the wrong building, wrong location because you could buy. Sometimes there’s a lot more options for a business when they’re leasing and there’s less options when they’re buying. ⁓ So ⁓ I try not to let my clients really, really want to buy like, well, don’t put your business in the wrong spot and we can buy you an investment property. But if you can get the two to match, it’s a wonderful opportunity. Another thing that I’ve seen ⁓

investors do with us is ⁓ team with a user. In other words, if one of your listeners has a business and they don’t really want to put out the capital to buy a property, ⁓ then they can do it with an investor and they team up. So the investor puts down the cash, they’ve got a tenant that wants to take care of the building. So there’s ways for users to really create value, whether without cash really, if they set up with the right

broker and partnerships.

Cody Crabb (09:42)
Well that actually

is, that pivots great into the next thing I was gonna ask you which is, ⁓ for people that are kind of moving into commercial, ⁓ how do you know ⁓ when you should use a broker and how to even choose? mean if you’re just doing a quick Google search, you’re gonna find basically anything you could possibly imagine on the market. So how do you even pick the right commercial broker?

Michael Bull, CCIM (10:42)
Yeah, so I think it’s different if you’re looking to buy or sell or lease, right? But if you’re a user and you need space for your business, I would use a broker every time and I would pick a broker that focuses on that sector. In other words, do they do medical? Like we have medical tenant reps. That’s all they do. The value is incredible. ⁓ You know, is it the day to do industrial or retail or office? I’d find a good tenant rep. I’d sign them up to make sure that I’m at the top of their list every day to get my mission done.

If you’re looking to buy properties, ⁓ then I think you want to find out the commercial brokers who are focused in your sector in your area and build a relationship with them. ⁓ Let them know you’re be honest with them about your experience, your ability, ⁓ that you’ll look at deals quickly and get back to them. You’ll protect them on off-market deals. Let them know that.

you’ll underwrite their reasonable fee if there’s no fee involved. So maybe they bring you off-market opportunities. And then if you’re looking to sell a property, I would look at, again, who are the brokers who do that property type in those areas, and then interview them. When you interview them, I’d ask exactly how they do.

what they do. ⁓ Do they fully cooperate with other brokers? Do they fully cooperate with other brokers and compensate them? Do they do that day one in the marketing assignment or do they wait? Do they trickle market properties or do they go to the market in the beginning in a big way? Do they use systems and things like that to get more buyers or do they only use a database? And some of the properties that people sell with us,

They only want us to use a database and do direct marketing. There’s reasons they don’t want the public to figure out they’re for sale. ⁓ Like some of the senior housing, some of the larger investment properties. ⁓ But then some of the smaller to medium properties, they really should be out in the market in a really big way. So that’s what I do, just interview the brokers and ask, really, how do you actually do this?

Cody Crabb (12:44)
Well, so give me some good interview questions. What kind of questions should they be asking that would really kind of make the difference?

Michael Bull, CCIM (12:54)
Who are the buyers in your database that you would go directly to as far as what groups, how many are there, where are they, how do you classify the folks that you’re going to go directly out to and how are you going to do that? What systems are you going to put the property in to get it out on the market? ⁓ Will you be offering ⁓ buyer agents a commission? ⁓ If so, how much do you plan to offer? ⁓ And then,

you know, what’s your offer memorandum look like? What’s your mark and collateral look like? ⁓ That would be some good questions.

Cody Crabb (13:33)
Yeah, mean, ⁓ that’s one thing that we always kind of run into is, you know, we’re working with someone who maybe has a really deep expertise, but in that way, that also kind of makes it so that we have to figure out how to vet their expertise. And so it be really tricky, I think, especially, like you said, you know, finding somebody that specializes in a particular ⁓ asset. mean, I can imagine that’s tricky. How do you kind of do that when, like, let’s say I’m looking at ⁓

buying some kind of, let’s say medical, because you mentioned medical, let’s say I wanted to buy some medical facility, but how am I supposed to know if this medical ⁓ person that I’m working with knows anything? Like how do I vet as someone that doesn’t know about it?

Michael Bull, CCIM (14:19)
Sure. Well, one thing is to call, you can call someone like me and I can, I have systems to know what brokers do what all over the country through ⁓ CCIM and through CoStar and

through TCM Worldwide that we’re member of. And we can figure out what somebody needs a broker to do in their specialty, and we can give them some recommendations of people to interview. And then from there, you just ask about their experience. What have you sold lately? What leases have you done lately if you’re looking to do a tenant rep? Do they only do medical tenant representation, or they do other things? Sometimes, if you’re in smaller market,

You know, maybe a broker would need to do all sorts of things, right? But if you’re looking in Chicago or York, Atlanta or something like that, and you want medical office space, you want to deal with a medical office broker. I they’re just going to know the market, that the value they’re going to add is tremendous. The efficiency of their work, like we have a multifamily team here, that’s all they’d sell. And so the efficiency is incredible and in the experience. just ask them about those things.

Cody Crabb (15:28)
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. ⁓ So

let’s kind of pivot here. So ⁓ we’ve been talking about buying a lot. I want to ask you a little bit about selling. ⁓ if a buyer, ⁓ well, how can a buyer kind of make their offer look its best to a ⁓ potential broker or something? If you’ve got something that you want to bring to them, I mean, how do you kind of dress it up as best you can?

Michael Bull, CCIM (15:44)
sure.

to me.

Yeah, that’s a good question, Cody. I just could see people make mistakes and ⁓ mistakes to avoid and how to fix them. One is if you’re using a board of realtors form, L.O.I. or you’re using a agent who is not a known.

commercial broker. Sometimes immediately they go, well, why are they working with an agent at a residential named company? And that, so a seller goes, that’s odd. And then if it comes in ⁓ a board of realtors, LOI forum, then the seller looks at it. They’re going have their own forums, their broker doesn’t. So then also, ⁓

look at the offer and I’ve seen some offers come in, they were AI written. And so you immediately just discount these people. And you can tell. ⁓

And then another thing to help your offers look good sometimes is to, you know, if you can skip the LOI process, letter of intent and come in with a purchase and sale agreement form, not a one buyer, one sided written by a attorney representing the buyer, but a more generic kind of form that, because sometimes if there are multiple offers and the seller sees three LOIs and one PSA purchase sale agreement, might say, well, you know what, this guy’s more serious.

Another thing that is a really good trick ⁓ is to put up considerable earnest money. Some people go, well, why do need earnest money? Well, you don’t need it, but it means a lot to sellers sometimes. I’ve seen sellers with three offers turn down two higher offers, go with the lowest offer because of the earnest money. Even when I told the seller, it didn’t make sense to do that. They said, I don’t like that guy. So at one time, ⁓

an older lady, she’ll probably be my age now, but I was in my 20s, 28 years old, I had a lot of experience and thought I knew everything, of course. And I was talking to this lady, she was in my office, I’m legal pad, I’m writing down what she wants to offer, price, and she says, us money, and she says, a million dollars. And the deal was like a million two or something. I said, well, that’s too high, you don’t need to put down that much. She said, it’s gonna be a million dollars. And I said again, that’s too much. She goes, Michael, no, she said, Mr.

bull. So I was in for some skill. She said,

not only am I going to put a million dollars in this money down, you told me you’re going to present this offer in person. Is that correct? I said, yes, ma’am. She said, all right, not only am going to write a million dollars money check, you’re going to take the check to the presentation. You’re going to turn it around and you’re going to slide it in front of them. And I said, yes, ma’am, I am certainly going to do that.

Cody Crabb (19:19)
I bet at the time you were like,

I’m gonna feel like the coolest, like that is gonna be the best moment. So what was that? Do you remember that moment? Like, what was that like?

Michael Bull, CCIM (19:23)
Thank

Good.

Sure, mean, that’s why I bring it up. It makes a big difference to sellers. And if you think about it, it’s a very inexpensive way. What’s the interest on that for 60 days ⁓ in an escrow account? There might be an interest-bearing escrow account even. ⁓ And then if you make sure that you’ve got it with a safe escrow agent and you’ve got a very well-written contract in a very clear situation, the money should not be at risk at all. ⁓ You can write contracts where it’s just not at risk.

especially in the commercial real estate world. So I’ve seen that work really well and then the written PSA, blue ink, original signatures, hand delivered, and then showing your ability.

Cody Crabb (20:15)
Yeah.

Michael Bull, CCIM (20:15)
Let them

know what you know about the property. you been there? Have you reviewed the deliverables? Tell them how you’re funding it. Tell them about deals you’ve done. Make them feel comfortable that there’s a high surety of close. Because what we do as brokers, and we’re listing commercial properties every day here. ⁓ And when we look at offers, we’re like gauging sure, if we get multiple offers, and we have three in a row, and we have the pricing, there’s money, timetables, contingencies. But then the biggest buy-in,

to us a shuri of clothes right because none of that matters if it’s not going to close ⁓ so if you can shove sellers and brokers that then you can have a leg up

Cody Crabb (20:57)
I find it interesting that I would have thought that someone like you would be like, it’s all about the numbers. Like we’re just talking about numbers, but it sounds like there’s a little more psychology than kind of spreadsheet logic. I mean, do you feel like that’s the case?

Michael Bull, CCIM (21:12)
Sure, there is. And some of it’s just a relationship too. I’ve seen some buyer agents who are combative with the listing agents. And it’s like, in commercial real estate, that doesn’t work very well. There’s no requirement for cooperation, first of all. It’s not like some of them.

Cody Crabb (21:28)
True.

Michael Bull, CCIM (21:29)
multi-list systems where these agents are required to cooperate, ⁓ they’re just not. And they can tell you, this is my exclusive listing. We’re not working with you. ⁓ And so the name of the company you’re with, the reputation you have, the way you interact with the brokers can really benefit you if you do it correctly.

Cody Crabb (21:52)
⁓ Yeah, I love that million dollar check story. That’s going to stick with me. That’s just such a cool story. ⁓ So I find that really interesting. So ⁓ when would that earnest money trick, ⁓ when would you say that’s like, it’s a perfect situation to use that? Like, I’d be curious to know what when you think, yes, lean hard on that.

Michael Bull, CCIM (21:55)
Thanks.

Well, I think you always want to make sure you have enough earnest money that it doesn’t cause suspicion. You know, I’ve seen some offers come in and I want to call the buyer and go, you’re not renting a studio apartment here. You’re buying a commercial property. ⁓ So you’re not going to be taken seriously ⁓ with that amount. ⁓ And, know, I’ve never discouraged an offer, but I will tell a buyer that look, before we present this, this is really what you want to put down. ⁓

because it might be a sign to the seller that you’re not serious. So I think any time a reasonable amount of earnest money is helpful, but the other time it’s helpful if you know there’s competing offers ⁓ and you want without raising your price, you want to do something to make your offer more attractive.

Cody Crabb (23:02)
That’s a good trick. I wanna circle back to something you said a minute ago. You said AI written offers. You kind of were like, yeah, we’re not even gonna look at that. as a big, I’m a proponent of using AI responsibly and not letting it kind of do everything for us. So I think, I would be curious to know, I think it seems like, you correct me if I’m wrong, it seems like you…

The thing that you were discounting and saying, I don’t like that was that it was not a human serious, like thoughtful offer that you were receiving. Is that right?

Michael Bull, CCIM (23:37)
Right. know, in commercial real estate, typically we deal with pretty sophisticated buyers and experienced buyers and brokers. So when something comes across as real in experience, we’re like, okay, the surety of clothes is just going down. ⁓ And the fact that they used AI instead of their own experience and their own knowledge, it’s just a signal that it’s not a strong person to deal with or company as someone who has their own letter of end and their own writings.

Cody Crabb (23:50)
Yeah, sure.

Well, let me ask you this then. ⁓ So what makes an offer feel credible and, you know, like they’re demonstrating experience? Like, what do you see in there that catches your eye?

Michael Bull, CCIM (24:21)
I just think ⁓ details that they understand the process, they understand the required timeframes, ⁓ the right amount of earnest money, ⁓ they’re forward about how they’re going to handle the capital stack, how they’re acquiring the property, ⁓ and then a lot of times they’ll present with their offer their resume.

Here’s the properties they bought or sold or owned, ⁓ sometimes even references from other brokers ⁓ where they’ve done deals. I know I’ve had clients ask me for references for their files ⁓ that show that they were good buyers, that they closed on the same price as they went into during the LOI process, that they closed on time and were good to work with. So I think including that resume can be very helpful.

Cody Crabb (24:53)
Hmm.

Yeah, that’s a really good, like it’s human, it’s very human. I really like that. Because the thing is, mean, the better AI gets, the more it’s going to be undetectable and we’re not gonna be able to see, you you say, oh, it’s clearly written by AI. I’m sure you’ve written, you’ve read plenty of these that were written by AI, but you weren’t able to tell. And so I think that’s the key here is that I think, you know, what you were sensing was they don’t care enough to put the.

they’re not sharing their personal experience. They’re not showing their expertise. They’re not putting the time in. It looks like they were just hurriedly putting something together. So I think that’s the lesson here is that whether or not it’s written by AI, like what’s in it? What kind of things are you including and what are you trying to demonstrate when you submit that? ⁓ So, OK, we’re kind of winding down here. But tell me a little bit about what bull realty is doing today and kind of what’s ⁓

in the near future for you guys.

Michael Bull, CCIM (26:21)
Yeah, well, we recently were picked up by TCN Worldwide, a worldwide association of commercial brokerage firms. And we’ve been wanting to get in with them for a couple of decades. ⁓ So that’s been pretty exciting. ⁓ It gives our assignments.

you know, national and worldwide exposure to sell larger institutional size properties. ⁓ And we’re just continuing to grow in the Southeast. We’re continuing to look for brokers to join us ⁓ and ⁓ just always continually improving our marketing process, continuing cleaning our offer memorandums and packages. ⁓ So…

Yeah, that’s kind of doing the same thing we’ve been doing. It’s just an ongoing mission. The reason the company was started ⁓ was still kind of what drives us is one, to be known for high integrity that you did with anyone at Bull Realty. They’re just extremely high character with a lot of integrity. ⁓ And then secondly, to have the best commercial real estate for sale marketing in the country for dispositions. So those are kind of two things that drive us that we always want to treat everyone

in

a transaction the way we’d want to be treated if we were them. While keeping in mind who our client is, we’re treating everybody with respect in the communication, the disclosures, the information that we’d want to have if we were them.

Cody Crabb (27:48)
Absolutely. Well, I’d be curious to know, what do you see in the future? Anything kind of exciting coming up or that you see kind of down the road at all?

Michael Bull, CCIM (27:59)
You know, I think it’s an interesting market when you look at what’s going on with the world. ⁓ And, ⁓ you know, we’ve had…

all kinds of crazy stuff, with wars and tariffs and elections and ⁓ it just doesn’t seem to stop. you know, I think when you look at the volatility of the markets, it’s real estate, it’s a good place to be, you know, long term, real estate always does well because of inflation, guess, mainly. ⁓ So I think it’s just a really good time. You know, people ask me, ⁓

when’s a good time to get in or get out, I’ll tell them if you’re at a party, you’re at a cocktail party and people talk about how great the market is, how they’re flipping contracts and everything’s so great, you should be selling.

And then everybody said that at the party is talking about the real estate’s in the dump. It’s never coming back. It’s not good. You should be buying. So that’s what I’ve seen throughout my career is the people, the groups that bought when the market was down, they create the most wealth. And you look at the people who bought, you know, homes after homes when their values plummeted. look at retail, the same thing, multifamily back in the late eighties.

you know, now with Office. So I think if you can look for properties that people think aren’t doing well or are harder to finance and you can figure out a way to finance them, that could be a great thing to do is look at those kinds of properties like right now. I think Office is, if you can find the right opportunity, is a wonderful thing to invest in right now.

Cody Crabb (29:43)
Well, Michael, this has been excellent. Thank you so much for all of this. I think big one of the big takeaways is, you know, there’s so much more than just numbers that are involved here. You know, the surety of clothes, broker reputation, the presentation you give the earnest money like relate these with the relationship. mean, so much of this is something that you can control. So it may not be the best offer on paper, but you really can still move the needle with some things that you can do for for people that are listening that kind of want to learn more about you.

Michael Bull, CCIM (30:00)
Thanks.

Cody Crabb (30:13)
connect with you, maybe even talk with Bull Realty about commercial or other property opportunities, where should they go online to find you?

Michael Bull, CCIM (30:22)
Yeah, so find me at bullrealty.com. My email is an easy one. It’s [email protected]. ⁓ and then if there’s any commercial agents listening and they want to learn more about brokerage skills, they can go to commercialagentsuccess.com.

Cody Crabb (30:30)
Fantastic.

Well again, thank you so much for your time and thank you listeners for joining us as well If you got something out of this episode, which you did I know you did please ⁓ Give us a like follow subscribe all the things and make sure you don’t miss another episode so that you can get every conversation with someone as Great as Michael once again, it’s been a real pleasure. Thank you so much for joining us today Take care

Michael Bull, CCIM (31:02)
Thank you.